From: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca on behalf of Cdn-Firearms Digest [owner-cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca] Sent: Thursday, 26 April, 2001 22:25 To: cdn-firearms-digest@broadway.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Subject: Cdn-Firearms Digest V3 #743 Cdn-Firearms Digest Thursday, April 26 2001 Volume 03 : Number 743 In this issue: Man avoids jail for armed standoff SEARCH FOR KILLER'S GUN WIDENS Letter: GUN CONTROL ADVOCACY A NECESSARY CAUSE FROM THE ARCHIVES Re: School gun safety CFGC Speaks (they called me a brat) Lobbyists... Fw: Re: BCWF position on gun registry Bill C-15 Debate Put-Off Again Re: Man avoids jail for armed standoff Re: digest submissions Ted Morton Re: 1916 German Luger? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 08:10:26 -0600 From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: Man avoids jail for armed standoff PUBLICATION: The StarPhoenix (Saskatoon) DATE: 2001.04.26 EDITION: FINAL SECTION: Local PAGE: A11 BYLINE: Lori Coolican SOURCE: The StarPhoenix - -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -------- - ---- Man avoids jail for armed standoff - -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -------- - ---- A 40-year-old Saskatoon man involved in a standoff with police after a domestic dispute in February will not spend time behind bars. Floyd Rocky Gillis was given a six-month conditional sentence and one year of probation Wednesday for assaulting his wife and threatening to shoot her and their three children and then commit suicide with a rifle he kept in a bedroom closet. The conditions of his sentence include treatment for alcohol addiction, participation in a domestic violence alternatives program, abstaining from alcohol and avoiding all bars and liquor stores. He is prohibited from possessing or using a firearm for 10 years. Crown prosecutor Warren Holmes said police surrounded the family's home on Avenue W South at about 11 p.m. Feb. 15, after one of the children called 911 from a bedroom. After about 45 minutes, Gillis's wife and children escaped through the front door. His wife had a bloody nose, and told police he showed her the and threatened to use it after an argument about the house, Holmes said. One of their children told police she overheard her father threaten to put a bullet in her mother's head, he said. During the ensuing standoff, which lasted about 3 1/2 hours, Gillis agreed to leave the rifle bolt on the front step. An emergency response team entered the house a short time later and arrested him. The rifle was found in the closet. Gillis was originally granted bail on condition that he have no contact with his wife and children. However, Judge Patrick Carey lifted the clause Wednesday at his wife's request. Defence lawyer Scott Hopley said Gillis's family hoped he could go home so they could all start getting their life back to normal. He is remorseful about the incident and realizes the seriousness of its effect on his wife and children, Hopley said. - -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -------- - ---- Click here to find the last ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 08:11:49 -0600 From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: SEARCH FOR KILLER'S GUN WIDENS PUBLICATION: The Calgary Sun DATE: 2001.04.26 SECTION: News PAGE: 10 SOURCE: Calgary Sun BYLINE: Peter Smith KEYWORDS: Crime; Murder; Calgary - -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -------- - ---- SEARCH FOR KILLER'S GUN WIDENS - -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -------- - ---- A massive search for the gun used to murder Calgary mom Corinne Belanger spread down the eastern outskirts of the city yesterday. Led by homicide detectives, the search teams -- including veteran volunteers experienced at using metal detectors -- scoured ditches beside roads just outside the city limits. Belanger, 37, who has a young son, Clayton, was found shot dead in her home at 92 Templeby Rd. N.E. on April 16. Police believe the killer's DNA, fingerprints or fibres from his clothing could still be on the , which they believe may have been thrown from a car as the killer fled. "Weapons used in such crimes are often discarded shortly after the culprit flees the scene," said Staff Sgt. George Rocks of the homicide unit as he briefed searchers yesterday. All day Tuesday, searchers checked ditches in the far northeast, and yesterday's search extended to the area covered from 16 Ave. at 84 St. N.E., as far south as Glenmore Tr. S.E. "This is a logical step, as anyone fleeing a murder scene is likely to discard a weapon which could connect him to the crime," said Rocks. Homicide Det. Al Brown said it would be wrong not to thoroughly search the area -- and discover later the murder weapon had been lying discarded alongside the road all the time. Four veterans of the Calgary Metal Detecting Club played a major role in the search. For Bill Penman, Don Thomas, Jerry Hall and Al Dedman, this was their second day of searching with their $800 to $1,000 metal detectors capable of finding something as small as a coin under several inches of soil. "If we find anything, we mark it and call in a search supervisor and let them examine it. We don't touch anything," said Hall. Police are asking any member of the public who finds a to report it to them. "Don't touch it, but call us at 266-1234," said Rocks. Belanger had lived in the upstairs section of her home while her estranged common-law husband lived downstairs. Homicide detectives interviewed the husband and eliminated him as a suspect. More than 200 mourners paid their final respects to Belanger, who had worked at the Alberta Energy Co., when they attended her funeral on the weekend. Homicide detectives haven't revealed any motive for the slaying. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 08:12:57 -0600 From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: Letter: GUN CONTROL ADVOCACY A NECESSARY CAUSE PUBLICATION: The London Free Press DATE: 2001.04.26 SECTION: Editorial/opinion PAGE: A8 COLUMN: Letters to the editor SOURCE: London BYLINE: Maria A. Reilly KEYWORDS: Gun Control - -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -------- - ---- GUN CONTROL ADVOCACY A NECESSARY CAUSE - -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -------- - ---- Regarding Bill Brady's excellent column, A role unworthy of a great actor (April 5), on Charlton Heston's passion for guns and the rebuttal, Gun control advocacy off target by John Evers (April 16), I believe Evers owes the American people an apology for implying the reason America is a great nation is due to the fact that anyone is entitled to bear arms. People make a nation great, not guns. All the committed and fanatical gun lobbyists needs is to be on the receiving end of the weapon to understand the finality of criminal or irresponsible persons having ready access to . If after this they still were able to, they would scream to high heaven for protection and gun control. Guns do kill and maim people. I was there and have to suffer for the rest of my life the terrible consequence of being at the wrong place at the wrong time. It couldn't and shouldn't have happened if there had been stricter gun control. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 08:08:25 -0600 From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: FROM THE ARCHIVES PUBLICATION GLOBE AND MAIL DATE: THU APR.26,2001 PAGE: R10 BYLINE: CLASS: From the Archives EDITION: Metro DATELINE: WORDS: 258 - -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -------- - ---- FROM THE ARCHIVES - -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -------- - ---- 25 years ago: On Feb. 26, 1976, The Globe and Mail reported the Canadian government planned to introduce an anticrime bill that would authorize police seizure of guns without warrants. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 09:48:04 -0600 From: Garry Subject: Re: School gun safety I am glad to see that there are more and more people taking safety courses to the classroom. I teach at the junior high level and once per week, for twelve weeks, we have a two hour session of option classes. These are special interest activities which are not tied to the everyday curriculuim of Math, Language Arts etc. Last year I approached the school board with the Canadian Firearms Safety Course and they were quite willing to accept it as an option at the junior high level. This year one of our local high school teachers became a qualified instructor and teaches it at the high school. I have to devise extra activities for the kids as I have to provide 24 hours of instruction for my students but this is not difficult. The only thing I have to watch is that I may not get into anything political in the classroom. The course is popular and I always have a full class. If there are any gun owning teachers lurking out there who have this opportunity to get some young people started off on the right foot, then please take it. These kids will be voting in a few years! Safe shootin' dorm ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 11:35:49 -0600 From: Jim Powlesland Subject: CFGC Speaks (they called me a brat) Organization: Calgary Community Network Assoc. Here is the reply I received from Coalition for Gun Control concerning my question about their failure to file under the Corporations Act. Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 09:31:52 -0400 From: Coalition To: "powlesla@calcna.ab.ca" Subject: Fwd: Data posted to form 1 of http://www.guncontrol.ca/feedback.htm Dear Mr. Bratt Thank you for your inquiry.I would suggest visiting our website (www.guncontrol.ca) which will be able to answer most of your questions. Should you require more specific information, please do not hesitate to contact us. Yours truly, Lisa Johnson Coalition for Gun Control - -------------Forwarded Message----------------- > I read that your registration was cancelled because you failed to > file information under the Companies Act for two years in a row. Is > that true? - --- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 11:48:23 -0600 From: Subject: Lobbyists... Recent comments on lobbying prompt me to post this, just out. Linda LATEST HILLWATCH BULLETIN: For this month only, we have 'bumped' our Bulletin and replaced it with a Brief submitted today in our appearance before the Parliamentary Standing Committee of Industry. The Committee is reviewing the Lobbyist Registration Act. We explained how the Web is making lobbying more transparent. We talked about the problems and then showed how to open up the system even more - if they want to. http://www.hillwatch.com/ English http://www.hillwatch.com/submissionenghome.htm Français http://www.hillwatch.com/submissionfrenhome.htm ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 14:49:12 -0600 From: "med2" <929200@ican.net> Subject: Fw: Re: BCWF position on gun registry FW'D. from BCW Fed. Sender address in text below. MED > > > >Darlene: > >I never even thought to bring it up at the noon meeting in Kelowna, > >because the philosophy hasn't changed. We do not support registration and > >we will do nothing to assist the government with registration. We will > >continue to try and get the registration function dropped, however it is > >in legislation and there is no indication that the government has any > >interest in changing that legislation. Even though the whole process looks > >more useless as it proceeds. > > > >Having said that, you saw the new proposed registration forms and heard > >about their plan to have people register on the honour system. > > > >I just got back from a meeting with the CFC staff in Vancouver and that is > >still the plan. > > > >I cannot tell people to "not register", neither individually nor as a > >representative of the BCWF. Although we recognize the stupidity of the > >law, it is the law of the land now and there are risks and costs > >associated with ignoring it. Each person will have to make up their mind > >if they are going to comply and to what extent. But here is some further info: > > > >1. Each person who has a possession license will get a letter and the > >registration forms to complete. They now have us all in their data base > >and they know that we have at least one firearm. > >2. The original plan was to have individual registration cards for each > >firearm. All of the firearms that I purchased after my break-in are > >registered and I have a card for each one. I originally thought that I > >would be required to have the card available and with the firearm when I > >had it outside my residence. Now we are told that they are not going to > >continue with that system and that all of your firearms will simply be > >listed on one sheet of paper that they will send to you. > >3. You will either fill in the registration form that they send to you and > >mail it back to them and they will scan it into the system. It will not > >need to be verified. Or you will have the option of being able to register > >on-line through the internet. They did not talk about cost this time > >around, but at a previous meeting talked about making no charge to > >register. Even the CFC is saying not to register until the new system is > >in place. > >4. They will initiate a publicity campaign to try and get people to register. > > > >Also of interest: > >The silliness of percussion blackpowder guns being "firearms", while > >flintlocks or wheellocks are not, was pointed out. They agreed that it did > >not make much sense and it will go back to the technical committee for > >review. It would be nice to see common sense prevail there. > > > >There was also discussion about crossbows. The regulations for them > >haven't been proclaimed yet, but registration of them doesn't make much > >sense. Nor does it make much sense to have to take a firearms training > >course in order to get a PAL in order to purchase one. They are not > >willing to walk away from them completely, but indicated a willingness to > >look at the problem and see if they could arrive at a reasonable solution. > > > >The airgun situation is still an issue. I am somewhat confused about how > >it is being solved. I was told by one staffer that to be considered a > >firearm an airgun would have to pass both the velocity and energy test. > >Thus if it was under 500 fps it would not a firearm, regardless what the > >energy was. That would clear paintball guns and potato guns and the like. > >But it is going back to the technical committee for discussion again, so > >will have to wait and see what comes out of that. They are sticking with > >factory specs and not individual testing as the RCMP was doing for a while > >using different pellets and reclassifying based on their own results. > > > >There are some Olympic class airguns that are over the 500 fps range and > >are causing problems for training and competition for junior shooters that > >they are trying to find a way to work around. > > > >There also has been problems with minors not being allowed to apply for a > >license until they actually turn 18 which leaves them in limbo (minor's > >permit invalid) until it is issued. CFOs have apparently agreed to accept > >applications up to 6 months in advance of the 18th birthday, but the > >information has apparently not been made available to the staff. That > >should change immediately. > > > >The difficulty with trying to accomplish any meaningful change is that so > >much is actually in legislation and not under the regulations. Regulations > >can be changed by the bureaucracy but changes in legislation are a horse > >of a different colour. We have always said that not only was it bad law, > >it was badly written law. We have certainly seen nothing to change that > >opinion. > > > >I think that pretty much covers the ground. If you have any other > >questions, just ask. > > > >John > > > >John B. Holdstock > >Kelowna, B.C. > > > >jholdsto@bctree.com > >http://www.bcwf.bc.ca > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: Darlene Clark > >To: John Holdstock > >Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2001 5:54 PM > >Subject: BCWF position on gun registry > > > >Hi John, > > I didn't get a chance to follow up on something that was brought up at > > the noon firearms session at the convention....the BCWF position on the > > firearms registry, defy it or continue as before. I was hoping to talk to > > you more about that, but didn't get the chance to. > > I was reminded about it when I saw a posting on the firearms chat about > > the BCWF's official position. > > Do we have one? Is it going to change? I left the meeting before the > > end of that discussion. We have an Island Region meeting coming up and I > > want to be prepared in case I'm asked that question. > >thanks for your info, > > Darlene > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 14:51:23 -0600 From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: Bill C-15 Debate Put-Off Again Today, we learned from the government that debate of Bill C-15 has been put off again. It was scheduled for debate for today (April 26th), then rescheduled to April 30th, and now it's not even on the schedule for May. The government has three categories identifying legislative priorities. C-15 is listed as "House to advance as possible", the lowest priority. The top priority is "House and Senate to pass by June" with the second being "House to pass by June". Highlights of C-15 On March 14, 2001, the Minister of Justice tabled a 78-page Omnibus bill (Bill C-15) amending the Criminal Code and other Acts - one of those being the Firearms Act. There are 22 pages of amendments to the Firearms Act and Part III of the Criminal Code. Bill C-15 also makes many other unrelated changes to the Criminal Code including: Child pornography on the internet, child sex tourism, criminal harassment, home invasions, disarming a police officer, cruelty to animals, conviction review, criminal procedure reform, and amendments to the National Defence Act and the National Capital Act. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 21:34:11 -0600 From: "Alan Harper" Subject: Re: Man avoids jail for armed standoff >A 40-year-old Saskatoon man involved in a standoff with police after >a >domestic dispute in February will not spend time behind bars. > >Floyd Rocky Gillis was given a six-month conditional sentence and >one year >of probation Wednesday for assaulting his wife and threatening to >shoot her >and their three children and then commit suicide with a rifle he >kept in a >bedroom closet. ============ Here's a guy who threatens to kill 4 people and he doesn't go to jail. That says something about these gun laws to me. It says that the laws exist to disarm the public, not to prevent criminal behaviour. As long as the government gets the guns, they don't give a damn about the lives of the people he threatened. Bye. Al. SI VIS PACEM, PARA BELLUM ************************* ____________________________________________________________________ _____ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 21:36:19 -0600 From: "Alan Harper" Subject: Re: digest submissions >Dear Moderator: > >I have been reading the digest for almost a year now, and one thing >is >beginning to bother me. We as members of the NFA are trying to make >the >government of Canada and the rest of the non-gun owner citizens of >this >country that we are sane and intelligent, and to take us seriously. >To this end I have a suggestion. We need to be perceived as not only >intelligent but educated in basic skills. Right now most of the >posts in >the digest are legible and make sense. But there are those that are >mispelled and have poor grammar. Even those members who have to get >the rant >on screen immediately can take a few seconds and check for spelling >errors >and typos. >If we want to be taken seriously then we need to take some time to >prepare >our submissions to the digest. As these are not changed by you the >moderator then we as the submitter need to do these simple things >ourselves. >And remember, even the computer makes mistakes. >I know that having this posted to the digest is going to get me >"flamed" by >several if not all of the other members, but I felt there was a need >to >express this. > >Merry-Sue ============== Lots of Canadians have no education, but are intelligent and decent people. They are like that because of family poverty, etc. My father and all my uncles were like that. Also, another fellow I know in my gun club. I notice their bad spelling, but I don't say anything. Most of those people with poor spelling and grammar are too old to correct it. More important is the civility that is evident on this forum. I also subscribe to other email lists and I notice that the flaming and rudeness factor is much higher on other forums. So, it's nice to be eloquent, but what's the point of criticizing what we can't change? By the way "mispelled" should be "misspelled". My 2 cents. Bye. Al. SI VIS PACEM, PARA BELLUM ************************* ____________________________________________________________________ _____ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 22:22:20 -0600 From: "Linda & Rory" Subject: Ted Morton Ted Morton appointed new "Director of Research" with CA. I have always been impressed with what I have read from and about Ted. I think he will do very well with CA. If you're on this list Ted -- congrats! Press release on the CA web site. Linda ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 22:24:54 -0600 From: LawrenceAWehren@aol.com Subject: Re: 1916 German Luger? Gentlemen: Are there any Luger enthusiasts on this list? A friend of mine at work has one in the family that they want an idea of what it is worth. His name is Dave and his email is thedfamily@hotmail.com. He sent me an email today with the following information that I copied onto this email: Please reply to his email address, thedfamily@hotmail.com Thank you, Larry Wehren Member of: West Coast Fieros of B.C. www.westcoastfieros.com 87GT 5sp Silver 86SE 4sp Red 85GT auto Red 88 Chevy Blazer 4X4 92 GMC Safari Some days are good days, some days are bad days, but Sundays are NASCAR ------------------------------ End of Cdn-Firearms Digest V3 #743 ********************************** Submissions: mailto:cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Mailing List Commands: mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Moderator's e-mail address: mailto:acardin33@home.com List owner: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca FAQ list: http://www.magma.ca/~asd/cfd-faq1.html and http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/Faq/cfd-faq1.html Web Site: http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/homepage.html FTP Site: ftp://teapot.usask.ca/pub/cdn-firearms/ CFDigest Archives: http://www.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca/~ab133/ or put the next command in an e-mail message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca get cdn-firearms-digest v03.n198 end (198 is the digest issue number and 03 is the volume) To unsubscribe from _all_ the lists, put the next five lines in a message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca unsubscribe cdn-firearms-digest unsubscribe cdn-firearms-alert unsubscribe cdn-firearms-chat unsubscribe cdn-firearms end (To subscribe, use "subscribe" instead of "unsubscribe".) 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