From: Cdn-Firearms Digest [owner-cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca] Sent: Friday, 01 March, 2002 12:23 To: cdn-firearms-digest@broadway.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Subject: Cdn-Firearms Digest V4 #580 Cdn-Firearms Digest Friday, March 1 2002 Volume 04 : Number 580 In this issue: [URL] For those that dealt with Ammomart in Ontario in the past - this is their "new" incarnation Re: Cdn-Firearms Digest V4 #574 Re: Officer refutes Eggleton version A Fantastic Registry Re: was it only box cutters after all ? Re: Proposed Digest Layout Changes COMMUNIQUE - CORRECTED HEADLINE Why did military officers refuse to take heat for their political boss? Animal-loving teen tries to chill TV show Re: A Fantastic Registry Soundly whipped C-68 Re: Officer refutes Eggleton version Firearms registry backfires, critics say ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 23:46:36 -0600 From: "Rod Regier" Subject: [URL] For those that dealt with Ammomart in Ontario in the past - this is their "new" incarnation http://www.higginsonpowders.com Higginson Powders Inc. 223 Front Rd. EastHawkesbury, ON K6A 2T1 Phone: 613--632-9300 FAX: 613--632-5666 Email: ahigginson@sympatico.ca Customer Service Hours BUSINESS HOURSMON. - FRI. 9 a.m. to 4 p.m SAT. 9 a.m. to 12 p.m. (noon Closed on Sundays. HIGGINSON POWDERS INC. DISTRIBUTION AREA IS NATION WIDE ACROSS CANADA. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 23:47:58 -0600 From: "W. Metner" Subject: Re: Cdn-Firearms Digest V4 #574 > Was this a provincial riding? If so/not, what party was Mr Harper > representing? He certainly wasn't a Reform MP when Kimmie was justice > minister. > > Mark Calgary West. He was the Reform MP. At least someone with that name was. I assume it's the same guy. The bill was C-17 as I recall. Regards Bill Metner ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 23:45:09 -0600 From: Don Webb Subject: Re: Officer refutes Eggleton version > Mr. Eggleton was under fire when the inquiry began > this month over his > failure to tell the Prime Minister about the mission > until Jan. 29, > eight days after he first learned about it. Don't kid yourself, Eggleton told Chretien. Eggleton was caught lying now they have to prove Chretien was lying too to prevent a Liberal caucus backlash in the House of Commons. Remember....everytime a Liberals lips are moving they're lying! __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 23:54:00 -0600 From: Barry Glasgow Subject: A Fantastic Registry Mr. Cauchon, I read with great interest, appreciation and delight your recent comments in the House regarding the gun registry. You stated, "Of course gun registration is something fantastic that we will keep working on in order to keep protecting Canadian society which has made the difference as a government." The Concise English Dictionary defines "fantastic" as; fanciful, whimsical, capricious,; odd, grotesque; uncertain, fickle, arbitrary; extravagant; fabulous, illusory, imaginary. I couldn't have picked a better way of describing the registry. We've seen how the 68 year-old handgun registry has not worked and the negative results of banning of handguns and registration of long guns in Britain. Do the right thing and get rid of this extravagant, fanciful and imaginary excuse for security. Barry Glasgow Woodlawn, Ontario __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 23:54:57 -0600 From: Gordon Hitchen Subject: Re: was it only box cutters after all ? And what do you think? Sounds possible of course but is it? Hard to imagine that many people sitting still for a box cutter. But then they probably didn't think they were going to die either. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 23:56:27 -0600 From: Thom McMillan Subject: Re: Proposed Digest Layout Changes Roger W., et al, I changed from the Digest to receiving individual messages sometime ago in order to be able to delete or save individual postings. If a posting lacks a descriptive "Subject", it gets deleted without hesitation. I find I read approximately 20% of the postings, mostly because I also subcribe to the "Full Bore List" and I just do not have the time to spend in front of the computer. Better to send several individual posting that can be individually filed than to ramble through one long posting that will be dumped. No one should feel that their post will be ignored out of hand, just stay to the point and please, provide a subject header. ===== END Thom MacMillan N.F.A. #21211 Email: or Brookfield, NS, B0N 1C0 Home Ph:(902)673-3015 Visit: __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 23:57:51 -0600 From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: COMMUNIQUE - CORRECTED HEADLINE COMMUNIQUÉ DE PRESSE Le 28 février 2002 Pour diffusion immédiate L'ENREGISTREMENT DES ARMES À FEU: UNE COLLECTE DE DÉCHETS QUI COÛTE 700 MILLIONS DE DOLLARS « Le ministère de la Justice a perdu la trace de 300 000 armes à feu enregistrées et de plus de 38 000 détenteurs de permis. » Ottawa - Le porte-parole officiel de l'opposition en matière de contrôle des armes à feu, Garry Breitkreuz, a rendu public aujourd'hui un recueil des dernières étourderies de la bureaucratie concernant le registre des armes à feu de 700 millions de dollars du gouvernement : DES ERREURS, D'AUTRES ERREURS ET ENCORE DES ERREURS. Le 7 février 2001, l'Edmonton Sun rapportait ce qui suit : [Traduction] Le président de l'Association canadienne de police, le constable Grant Obst, a déclaré hier qu'un grand nombre de policiers canadiens qui croient pourtant au principe d'un registre des armes à feu doutent sérieusement que celui du Centre canadien des armes à feu leur fournira un jour l'information dont ils ont besoin pour lutter contre la criminalité. « Ils ne sont pas contents de l'information recueillie, a-t-il dit. Ils se demandent si les renseignements sont exacts. » Le document de M. Breitkreuz répond à la question du constable Obst : « Si l'information contenue dans le registre n'est pas exacte, en quoi le registre peut?il être utile à la police? » « Qu'il s'agisse des quelque 300 000 armes à feu non réclamées dans l'ancien registre, des 38 629 détenteurs de permis dont on a perdu la trace l'an dernier, des 832 permis d'armes à feu délivrés en double, des dizaines de permis avec la mauvaise photo, des 57 certificats d'enregistrement établis pour 16 armes à feu appartenant à une seule personne, les bureaucrates du ministère de la Justice se sont révélés incapables de mettre à exécution le projet de loi C-68 et ne peuvent pas espérer tenir les promesses faites par le ministre, a commenté M. Breitkreuz. « Le registre des armes à feu est le plus formidable système de collecte d'ordures au Canada. Il n'est pas étonnant que les libéraux veuillent privatiser ce fouillis. » Un article paru en première page du Moncton Times and Transcript de lundi illustre à quel point l'exactitude des données contenues dans le registre des armes à feu est importante pour la police. [Traduction] La base de données est censée permettre aux policiers qui répondent à un appel de vérifier s'il existe des armes à feu dans la maison. L'agent saura ainsi s'il existe un danger grave à cet endroit. Mais certains patrouilleurs font valoir qu'il serait idiot de se fier à un registre que personne ne peut dire s'il est complet, et que les policiers qui ne sont pas conscients que tous les appels doivent être traités avec la plus haute prudence jouent avec leur vie. « À première vue, c'était un argument de vente excellent, a déclaré le policier de Sackville Ted Doncaster. Il s'est passé beaucoup de choses depuis, a-t-il ajouté en se moquant de ce dispositif de sécurité auquel les policiers peuvent se fier seulement à leurs risques. En somme, on s'est fait avoir. » « En dépit de toutes les preuves attestant du contraire, certains maintiendront que cette dépense d'un milliard de dollars pour le registre des armes à feu contribuera à améliorer la sécurité du public. Or, c'est malheureux, mais la sécurité du public est encore plus compromise par le registre des armes à feu, prévient M. Breitkreuz. Comme nous l'avons dit, les policiers peuvent être bercés par un faux sentiment de sécurité si l'ordinateur du registre indique qu'il n'y a pas de fusils dans la maison. À l'inverse, si l'ordinateur révèle la présence d'armes à feu alors qu'il n'y en a pas, les occupants sont en danger parce que les policiers sortent leurs armes avant d'entrer. Les erreurs présentes dans le système annulent le principe de base du registre. » « En 1995, le député de Leeds-Grenville, Joe Jordan, a déclaré à la télévision nationale que le registre des armes à feu n'était pas plus compliqué que le système d'impôt sur le revenu. J'imagine que c'est une coïncidence si le premier ministre a nommé un nouveau ministre de la Justice qui possède une certaine expérience de l'Agence des douanes et du revenu du Canada, a fait observer M. Breitkreuz. Lundi, le nouveau ministre de la Justice a affirmé fièrement au Parlement : « Nous sommes contents de ce que nous avons réalisé. Le registre des armes à feu fonctionne très bien. » (Hansard page 9201) « Regardez de nouveau, monsieur le ministre, les documents de votre propre ministère prouvent le contraire. » Le rapport de M. Breitkreuz DES ERREURS, D'AUTRES ERREURS ET ENCORE DES ERREURS est disponible à son site Web Cliquez ici: http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publications/errors-errors.htm - - 30- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 23:59:07 -0600 From: Bruce Mills Subject: Why did military officers refuse to take heat for their political boss? Gee, you don't think it could be because of the crappy funding they've been getting since the Lieberals have been in power, do ya? http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/printarticle/gam/20020228/UANALN Why did military officers refuse to take heat for their political boss? By JEFF SALLOT Thursday, February 28, 2002 – Print Edition, Page A6 OTTAWA -- Senior officers in the Canadian Forces seem to have decided they will no longer take the bullet for the mistakes of their political masters, military analysts say. Canada's two most senior officers testified before a Commons committee this week that Defence Minister Art Eggleton was fully briefed about a controversial operation in Afghanistan last month, a briefing the minister didn't seem to recall for several crucial days. "These guys, in effect, are putting the boots to the minister by telling the truth," military historian Jack Granatstein said, referring to the testimony of General Raymond Henault, Chief of the Defence Staff, and Vice-Admiral Greg Maddison, the vice-chief. "Canadians ought to be enormously proud of the integrity and forthrightness of their military officers," said Doug Bland, chairman of the defence management studies program at Queen's University. The testimony of the two officers will go a long way to restoring the faith of the rank and file that the Canadian Forces have not become a convenient punching bag for politicians when things go sour, said analyst Brian MacDonald, a former officer. "Reading between the lines, Gen. Henault and Adm. Maddison are telling us what it is they think about the ability of the minister to take in information, digest it and address it," said lawyer Michel Drapeau, another former officer. The officers' candid testimony stands in stark contrast to the Somalia scandal, in which soldiers were grilled before a public inquiry into the cover-up of the torture and killing of a Somali teenager by Canadian paratroopers in 1992. Kim Campbell, then defence minister, was running for the leadership of the Progressive Conservative Party, and senior defence officials did not want any embarrassments for her along the way. Mr. Granatstein and the other analysts say that if Mr. Eggleton's memory lapse is simply that, he should not be forced to resign. "If it is an honest error you probably cut him some slack," Mr. Granatstein said. "He's had a good run [four years as Defence Minister] and he hasn't screwed up previously." But if he has deliberately misled Parliament or Prime Minister Jean Chrétien, Mr. Granatstein said, "he's toast." Mr. Chrétien seems ready to stand by his minister, telling the House yesterday that Mr. Eggleton has his full confidence and that of the cabinet and the Liberal Party. Mr. Eggleton may be taking the fall for the Prime Minister, Mr. MacDonald said. "So that makes the minister fireproof." Mr. MacDonald said that the Privy Council Office, which is in effect Mr. Chrétien's own bureaucracy, should have known and should have informed the Prime Minister of the Afghan operation. Copyright © 2002 Bell Globemedia Interactive Inc. All Rights Reserved. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 01:38:22 -0600 From: Bruce Mills Subject: Animal-loving teen tries to chill TV show And exploiting teenaged bimbo girls isn't bad? And you can't tell me that people were interested in what she had to *say*... http://www.nationalpost.com/home/story.html?f=/stories/20020228/191509.html February 28, 2002 Animal-loving teen tries to chill TV show New York State of undress Jill Strelieff The StarPhoenix SASKATOON - The nearly naked woman who paraded outside a New York City television studio on Tuesday to protest the scheduled appearance of a wildlife television personality is an 18-year-old Saskatoon high school student. Erin Ruel donned only black panties and body paint as part of a People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals protest against the scheduling on Good Morning America of Jack Hanna, the director emeritus of the Columbus Zoo and Aquarium, who has made a name for himself appearing on televsion shows with animals. Mr. Hanna did not appear on the show. PETA is against the exploitation of baby wild animals for television entertainment. Some, however, suggest it's not the animals being exploited but Ms. Ruel herself. "Nobody told me to take my clothes off," Ms. Ruel said yesterday in an interview from New York. "I volunteered to do it. I was there because it was something that I felt was important to do." Andrew Butler, of PETA, says Ms. Ruel requested to be part of the protest in particular, and the leopard paint job was "tastefully done." "A lot of people that have seen these pictures say Erin looks stunning in them and she certainly does," Mr. Butler said. "She certainly wasn't entirely naked and the way that she was painted looked incredible. I'm thrilled people like Erin are able and are willing to do things that can be embarrassing, and certainly very cold if you're doing this in the streets of New York, to draw attention to what is some very serious animal abuse and animal exploitation," he said. Ms. Ruel joined PETA on her 18th birthday just two months ago. "She's doing that because she believes in something," said Patti Cram, Ms. Ruel's mother. "Whether she's 18 or 80, if more people did that we wouldn't live in such a messed-up world." The day before the protest, Ms. Ruel called her mother to tell her what it would involve. Ms. Cram was more than supportive and asked her daughter to call her the following day to tell her how it went. Ms. Ruel thought it went over very well. "A lot of people stopped and asked who's Jack Hanna and why are you out here, and they really listened to what I had to say," she said. "It's a really great way to get people to give attention to what you're doing." Mr. Hanna is the director of the Columbus Zoo and host of his television series Jack Hanna's Animal Adventures. He makes regular appearances on shows like Good Morning America, The Late Show with David Letterman, and Larry King Live and brings animals to show on the programs. PETA claims animals are placed under "enormous stress" in the "loud and alien environments" of television studios. Ms. Ruel said suffering New York winter weather in only panties meant nothing compared to the suffering of those baby animals. "It was cold and a little bit embarrassing, but it was worth it," she said. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 01:44:39 -0600 From: Bill McGarry Subject: Re: A Fantastic Registry Barry, your reply is just plain BEAUTIFUL! LOL! Bill ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 01:49:53 -0600 From: Bruce Mills Subject: Soundly whipped http://www.nationalpost.com/commentary/story.html?f=/stories/20020228/191789.html Soundly whipped Editorial National Post February 28, 2002 The House of Commons finance committee under Maurizio Bevilacqua, its former chairman and the current junior minister for Science, Research and Development, emitted a flicker of independence in Canada's otherwise rigidly controlled Parliament -- where even minor decisions are decided by the Prime Minister or his staff. Now, sadly, the committee's days of freelancing appear over. Last week, the selection of a replacement for Mr. Bevilacqua was "whipped" to ensure the job went to Sue Barnes, a London, Ontario MP of no particular note, but known for her adherence to the wishes of the PMO. In the past three years, the committee has taken unLiberal positions in favour of raising RRSP contribution limits, privatizing Crown corporations and increasing tax write-offs for charitable contributions. It has also recommended lowering personal and payroll taxes and eliminating capital taxes on corporations, the only such federal capital taxes in the G7. Long before anyone in Cabinet acknowledged the brain drain of skilled Canadians to the United States, the committee urged action to staunch it, admitting it was "like a fever," perhaps "not threatening in itself, but it tells us that the patient is sick." Since the terror attacks of Sept. 11, the committee, and Mr. Bevilacqua in particular, pushed for closer integration of Canada's currency and customs with those of the Americans. Ms. Barnes, the incoming chairwoman, was one of the few committee members to strongly oppose closer co-operation between with the United States. That Jean Chrétien, the Prime Minister, would then task Marlene Catterall, the Liberals' chief Commons whip, to force through Ms. Barnes election -- shortly after promoting the suspiciously anti-American Bill Graham to the senior post of Foreign Affairs Minister, and Chrétien's own vacillation about whether to support possible U.S. military action against Iraq -- appears to signal a growing skepticism in Ottawa toward Washington. It was also disquieting to note the manner in which Mr. Chrétien and Ms. Catterall rammed through Ms. Barnes' selection. Other contenders with a greater claim to the job, such as Toronto-area MP Roy Cullen, were told to stand down. Liberal members of the committee were threatened with demotion or other reprisals if they voted against their leader's wishes. Ms. Barnes "election" is already paying dividends for Mr. Chrétien. Yesterday, the new chairwoman adjourned a meeting before a crucial vote on an opposition motion to cut the Liberals air travel tax in half. The delay permitted officials time to work on wavering government members until they agreed not to support the motion. Members who still refused were temporarily replaced by the Liberal Whip's office with other government backbenchers who would. Later, when some government members voted with opposition MPs to lower capital gains taxes in the December budget, Ms. Barnes attempted to void the results, claiming the government MPs had not understood what they were voting on. Unlike U.S. Congressional committees, which present a true counterbalance to the power of the White House, or even British Commons' committees, which jealously guard what little independence they have, our Parliamentary committees deserve the reputation they have as rubber stamps of government policy. Their government members are selected by the PMO and their votes are subject to the same rigid party discipline as those in the Commons. The Commons finance committee was different -- was. Now one of the few glimmers of democratic autonomy in Ottawa has been snuffed out. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 12:18:00 -0600 From: "Cormack" Subject: C-68 We should not counsel anyone to break the law. The law is the law and it is up to the Canadian people to have it changed. If we want the gun law changed, we will have to work within the system. Civil disobedience will not be accepted in this country when it comes to non-compliance of the gun registry...due to the portrayal of guns that inundates the public everyday. The average Canadian worries only about his medicare, pension etc. Maybe if we took some of these things away we may get change in this country... Regards DJ. Udle ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 12:22:19 -0600 From: "Yannis Marine" Subject: Re: Officer refutes Eggleton version "Remember....everytime a Liberals lips are moving they're lying!" ...every time ANY politicians lips move they're lying. There is no politician in the world who will fight for his constituencies. Not one. Every one is looking to fulfill his/her ambitions, of publicityand for a fat easy pension. Any doubts? read some history. And the promises before and after. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 12:23:22 -0600 From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: Firearms registry backfires, critics say PUBLICATION: Red Deer Advocate DATE: 2002.02.28 SECTION: Canada PAGE: A5 SOURCE: CP DATELINE: Ottawa - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ---- Firearms registry backfires, critics say - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ---- Opposition critics say statistics continue to show the gun registry is not working and the percentage of violent crimes involving firearms has actually increased since Ottawa passed its gun control laws. The Progressive Conservative Democratic Representative Coalition said Wednesday that Statistics Canada figures show the percentage of attempted murders that involved a firearm increased from 31 per cent in 1995 to 37 per cent in 2000 - a jump of 20 per cent. The number of homicides that involved a gun also increased over the same time period. "What that shows is the firearms registry isn't working. It's having no effect on deterring the use of firearms to commit violent crimes, and at a huge cost," said PCDRC MP Jim Pankiw, who raised the issue in the House of Commons Wednesday. Justice Minister Martin Cauchon defended the much-maligned program, which was first introduced in 1994 and requires gun owners to obtain a license for their firearms. "We do believe in what we're doing," Cauchon told the House. By law, all firearms must be registered by Jan. 1, 2003. Penalities for not acquiring a license can result in up to five years in jail and seizure of any guns. However, Canadians have not been quick to comply. That forced Ottawa to waive the registration fees last October in an attempt to get more guns registered. Cost overruns, pegged by critics at over $600 million, have the federal government considering an outside agency to administer the program. Alliance MP Garry said crime statistics continue to stack up against the gun registry program, which he said is a waste of money that does nothing to prevent the misuse of guns. "We need to really examine what we're doing because it's having the opposite effect," he said. "We need to put those resources where they are best spent and that's putting more police on the street and going after the criminals because this is simply a bureaucratic paper-pushing exercise." "I would hope that the public would take notice of this soon." ------------------------------ End of Cdn-Firearms Digest V4 #580 ********************************** Submissions: mailto:cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Mailing List Commands: mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Moderator's e-mail address: mailto:acardin33@shaw.ca List owner: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca FAQ list: http://www.magma.ca/~asd/cfd-faq1.html and http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/Faq/cfd-faq1.html Web Site: http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/homepage.html FTP Site: ftp://teapot.usask.ca/pub/cdn-firearms/ CFDigest Archives: http://www.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca/~ab133/ or put the next command in an e-mail message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca get cdn-firearms-digest v04.n192 end (192 is the digest issue number and 04 is the volume) To unsubscribe from _all_ the lists, put the next five lines in a message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca unsubscribe cdn-firearms-digest unsubscribe cdn-firearms-alert unsubscribe cdn-firearms-chat unsubscribe cdn-firearms end (To subscribe, use "subscribe" instead of "unsubscribe".) 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