From: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca (Cdn-Firearms Digest) To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Subject: Cdn-Firearms Digest V5 #755 Reply-To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Sender: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Errors-To: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Precedence: normal Cdn-Firearms Digest Tuesday, February 11 2003 Volume 05 : Number 755 In this issue: UPDATED: WHAT POLICE HAVE SAID ABOUT THE GUN REGISTRY Re: ARTICLE: Arafat gets asinine plea from PETA on intefadeh What's the World's Most Stupid Security Measure? Regs, forms Fwd: NEWS STORY Gun control: Schools ban even the word Re: An Information Re: ARTICLE: Arafat gets asinine plea from PETA on intefadeh Bowling for Columbine Nominated for Oscar CAUCHON STONEWALLS HIS OWN BACKBENCHER Observations from the West Coast IX re: Copyright and the FRT disk GUN REGISTRY COST ESTIMATES ARE INCOMPLETE AND INACCURATE 'Rye' prof gunning for gun control Re: How Liberal Extremism endangers children Re: Observations from the West Coast IX Fw: Letter to the Editor - Gun cut from spelling tests Re: Fw: Letter to the Editor - Gun cut from spelling tests Re: My Letter to the Ottawa Citizen ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 13:58:39 -0600 (CST) From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: UPDATED: WHAT POLICE HAVE SAID ABOUT THE GUN REGISTRY WHAT POLICE HAVE SAID ABOUT THE GUN REGISTRY http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publications/policequotes.htm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 14:07:13 -0600 (CST) From: "MCNEIL, DAVE" Subject: Re: ARTICLE: Arafat gets asinine plea from PETA on intefadeh > Every so often, I violate my own policy against giving PETA -- People for the > Ethical Treatment of Animals -- the publicity it desperately desires and doesn't > deserve. I thought PETA stood for People Eating Tasty Animals. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 14:07:52 -0600 (CST) From: Roger Walker Subject: What's the World's Most Stupid Security Measure? http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/55/29279.html Human rights watchdog Privacy International has launched a quest to find the World's Most Stupid Security Measure. The global competition will identify what the group describes as the most "pointless, intrusive, annoying and self-serving" security measures. The "Stupid Security" award aims to highlight the absurdities of the security industry. Privacy International's director, Simon Davies, said his group has taken the initiative because of "innumerable" security initiatives around the world that had absolutely no genuine security benefit. ======================================================================== I am sure there are tons of specific items we could all be nominating for this award... - -- Roger Walker spam free @ http://www.evsmail.com Voice/Fax 1-780-440-2685 http://www.rat-hole.com "HIS Pain; OUR Gain" http://www.man-from-linux.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 14:18:22 -0600 (CST) From: "Richard A. Fritze" Subject: Regs, forms Bruce: The Minister has the authority to create forms and regs. See FA s.2(1) which reads, in part: . . . "prescribed" « réglementaire » "prescribed" means (a) in the case of a form or the information to be included on a form, prescribed by the federal Minister, and (b) in any other case, prescribed by the regulations; . . . Richard A. Fritze Barrister & Solicitor Tel. (780) 941 3809 www.fritze.com This communication is intended to be received by the individual or entity to whom or to which it is addressed and contains information that is privileged, confidential and subject to copyright. Any unauthorized use, copying, review or disclosure is prohibited. If received in error, please contact me at the telephone number above. Thank you. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 14:19:22 -0600 (CST) From: Gil White Subject: Fwd: NEWS STORY Gun control: Schools ban even the word I usually enjoy being kept informed and sometimes entertained by reading the digest. This story however finally pushed me over the edge and I couldn't help but respond to the Ottawa Citizen (response below). I guess many others felt the same as there were many responses... see the link below. http://www.canada.com/national/features/soundoff/story.html?id={DE06E5E3-685B-4751-841C-FAB8B263AADD}#Soundoff My God, or maybe I shouldn’t use that word it may offend somebody… I was totally shocked that a legitimate English word will no longer be thought in a school because of one complaint… What about the rest of the children in that school? How will they ever be able to describe a heat gun, Hilty gun, or cocking gun? It really amazes me how narrow minded some people can be. With all the controls or even a complete ban on guns world wide, they will not go away... there is an element of our society that have and will continue to have guns forever… Pretending that they don’t exist will not make them go away or improve safety in our neighborhoods. In the column Mrs. Sousa is quoted as saying "The word gun is synonymous with death. I'm racking my brain trying to figure out why a seven-year-old would need to learn this word," So what about the words car, bat, knife, or air plain just to name a few. These words can also be synonymous with death… after all more deaths are caused by these objects than guns. To Mrs. Sousa’s second point why a seven year old would need to learn the word? We teach children how to swim, ride their bikes safely and not speak with strangers in order to protect them from harm or even death. In fact there I believe there would be less accident involving children and guns if adults would be responsible enough to provide them with proper training. Trying to hide our children from reality or pretend these realities do not exist will not keep them safe. I worry about what would happen should Mrs. Sousa child happen to find an illegally stored firearm some day. I sincerely pray that there wouldn’t be another devastating headline about the death of a child. Gil White ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 14:23:44 -0600 (CST) From: Bruce Mills Subject: Re: An Information Edward Hudson wrote: > > To: city.desk@thesp.com > > Canadian Unregistered Firearms Owners Association > > Press Release > 11February2003 > > Provincial Crown Prosecutor, Mr Perry Polishchuk announced yesterday > that the obstruction charges against Dr Joe Gingrich of Nipawin and Dr > Edward Hudson of Saskatoon have been “stayed”. Did you get the receiver back? Yours in Liberty, Bruce Hamilton Ontario ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 15:02:29 -0600 (CST) From: "John E. Stevens" Subject: Re: ARTICLE: Arafat gets asinine plea from PETA on intefadeh At 02:07 PM 2/11/2003 -0600, Dave wrote: > > Every so often, I violate my own policy against giving PETA -- People > for the > > Ethical Treatment of Animals -- the publicity it desperately desires > and doesn't > > deserve. > > >I thought PETA stood for People Eating Tasty Animals. That would make a great bumper sticker :) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 15:04:11 -0600 (CST) From: Jim Powlesland Subject: Bowling for Columbine Nominated for Oscar http://www.oscars.com/nominees/nom_32105.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:43:13 -0600 (CST) From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: CAUCHON STONEWALLS HIS OWN BACKBENCHER House of Commons Debates Tuesday, February 11, 2003 ORAL QUESTION PERIOD Unedited copy - not official until printed in Hansard * * * Mr. Paul Steckle (Huron-Bruce, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, on December 5, 2002 in this House the supplementary estimates were passed devoid of new money for the firearms program. Today, without that funding, the national gun registry continues to receive new registration forms. Could the Minister of Justice tell the House from where the operational funds are coming? Hon. Martin Cauchon (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the member for his question. Up until the approval of the supplementary estimates we are moving with what we call cash management. We said it before Christmas. The program is running at minimum cost but we are able to fulfill our duty. Of course, it is a short term solution and we are sure that the House will support gun control and will support public safety as well, when we have to vote on supplementary estimates. * * * ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:43:54 -0600 (CST) From: "KPImages" Subject: Observations from the West Coast IX Here's an idea for those people in Alberta looking for some answers from the NFA. It's called Ambush Journalism. That's where you have a video camera and follow people around asking questions. You could start at the next gun show with your list of questions for whoever happens to show up. This video could easily be transferred to a website for everyone to view the responses that you get. This would work for MP's across Canada as well. It's called Freedom of Speech/Freedom of the Press and is protected under the Charter, at least for now. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:44:47 -0600 (CST) From: Rod Regier Subject: re: Copyright and the FRT disk A non-official comment from my contact: "The FRT project is a Law Enforcement initiative solely under the control of the RCMP. The books and reference material used for references also include the results of physical inspections, manufacturers catalogs and every known and respected firearms reference book available. All of our pictures are original photographs done in-house and represent firearms that are as close to original factory specifications as possible. We really believe in our product and have high hopes that it will become the world standard for firearm ID. We hope to release a commercial version at some point in the future." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:45:26 -0600 (CST) From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: GUN REGISTRY COST ESTIMATES ARE INCOMPLETE AND INACCURATE TOP TEN REASONS WHY THE LIBERALS' GUN REGISTRY COST ESTIMATES ARE INCOMPLETE AND INACCURATE http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publications/firearmsfacts2.htm GOVERNMENT'S NEWEST INCOMPLETE FORECASTS SHOW GUN REGISTRY WILL COST MORE THAN $1.3 BILLION BEFORE IT IS FULLY IMPLEMENTED (I.E. REACHES "STEADY STATE") http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publications/governmentgunforcast.htm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:46:29 -0600 (CST) From: "Ed Sieb" Subject: 'Rye' prof gunning for gun control 'Rye' prof gunning for gun control http://www.theeyeopener.com/storydetail.cfm?storyid=363 Professor Wendy Cukier refuses to back down from her stance on gun control - regardless of the threats to her safety and the hate-mail she recieves as a result of her contribution to the cause. Suzanne Ma takes a look at her fight against firearms. - ---------------------------------------------------------------- [PHOTO: http://www.theeyeopener.com/images/bin/nw-wendy-ottavio.jpg ] "Ryeron professor Wendy Cukier is the co-founder and president of the Coalition for Gun Control. While on sabbatical from Ryerson, she is spearheading the gun registry campaign. (Photo: Ottavio Cicconi)" - ----------------------------------------------------------------- By: Suzanne Ma January.22.2003 For Ryerson professor Wendy Cukier, it's routine to receive death threats. As co-founder and president of the Coalition for Gun Control, Cukier is at the centre of a sometimes ugly debate. The gun lobby, in an effort to combat Cukier's group, sends her bricks, manure, mens underwear, and a steady supply of letters. Letters vary from short, snappy rebuttals to crude personal attacks. She's been called a socialist, a man-hater and even a neo-Nazi. She also recieves vulgar phone calls, and threatening e-mails. "Wendy Cukier should be burned at the stake," reads a typical e-mail message. Cukier, however, doesn't let all the negativity get her down. "It's obviously upsetting when they're threatening to come to your house. "But I've been getting this stuff for so long," she said. "I'm abrasive and persistent. I don't back down." Cukier was involved in the struggle for gun control even before she co-founded the Coalition for Gun Control in 1991. She first became involved with the fight for gun control in the wake of the Montreal massacre. On Dec. 6, 1989 Marc Lepine walked into the University of Montreal's engineering school, and opened fire on every woman he saw. He shot 27 people, and killed 14 women. He then turned his semi-automatic rifle on himself. Investigations revealed that Lepine had a history of severe antisocial behaviour, yet he was able to legally acquire a Ruger Mini-14, a semi-automatic military weapon capable of firing 30 rounds of ammunition without reloading. Firearm laws at the time did not require registration except at the point of sale. "When I read about [the massacre] like many other Canadians, I was horrified that something like that could happen in Canada," said Cukier. "I dentified so strongly with the mothers of the [victims]. The more I looked into it, the more I found out about the state of our gun laws, and the more I became convinced we had to do something about it." The first thing Cukier did was look for a gun coalition to join. She soon discovered that there wasn't one in Canada and began to make contact with others who felt strongly about gun control. They formed the Coalition for Gun Control, which is determined to reduce gun death, injury and crime in Canada. In 1995, the group scored a major victory with the passage of federal gun control legislation that required all gun owners to be licensed and all guns registered. The legislation also bans assault weapons and controls the sale of ammunition. Despite the apparant victory, Cukier still can't rest. The gun registry plan has come under attack, as the deadline for registering passed this month. Ontario Attorney General David Young called the registry a "billion-dollar boondoggle" and said it should be be put on hold pending further investigation by the auditor general. "It makes absolutely no sense to proceed forward with this when the facts and the evidence clearly indicate that it is serving no useful purpose," said Young at a press conference in early January. Opponents such as Alliance Leader Stephen Harper claim the registry will be useless against preventing illegal firearms from falling into the hands of criminals. Cukier agrees that one billion dollars is a lot of money, but says the cost of not registering guns is higher. The gun registry, she says, is a way for the Canadian government to get a good idea of how many guns are out there and who is in possession of the weapons. Cukier compares the gun registry to getting a driver's licence. It's illegal to drink and drive or to speed, but licensed drivers do these things just the same. Far too often, drivers lose control of their cars. "The point is, we licence drivers to increase the chances that they will drive safely," she says. Bill Rantz, president of the NFA Ontario Branch says that as a taxpayer he finds the gun registry to be not only a ridiculous waste of money, but also something that gives Canadians a false sense of security. "As with any law, [it] is intended for those who obey them. Those who aren't going to obey any laws really couldn't care less whether the firearm is registered," he says. "A much better use of the money would be monitoring those who are known to police for violence, making sure that they don't have firearms." Rantz says the current gun registry system will eventually collapse because of its ineffciencies. "We see the coming of a new intelligent gun law, one that will protect the public, and use tax payers money wisely." he says. Rantz says public opinion is growing for the NFA's cause, and that even its strongest critics will eventually come around. "As for Wendy Cukier," he says. "I think sooner or later, she'll turn around too." Despite the opposition, the gun control legislation has been relatively successful on most fronts. According to the federal government, as of Nov. 23, 2002, a total of 1,897,161 of Canada's estimated three million gun owners were licensed. And, 75 per cent of Canadian gun owners met the Jan. 1 deadline to register their non-restricted firearms. But there's still much for Cukier to do. "It's seven years after the law passed and it seems that we're back to square one making all the same arguments. Some days I feel beleaguered and oppressed and unappreciated," she admits. "But most days I feel fortunate that I'm allowed to do what I do." Cukier says that she's grateful for the job she has at the university because it gives her a great deal of flexibility. "Ryerson is very supportive of what I do. I can say what I want, I can do what I want. A lot of people don't have jobs that can afford them that freedom of speech." Cukier will continue lobbying for more gun control in Canada. Tomorrow, she'll be teaching her classes, writing more papers and receiving more death threats. It's just another day. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Comments: http://www.theeyeopener.com/comment.cfm?storyid=363 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:47:05 -0600 (CST) From: Vulcun1isback@aol.com Subject: Re: How Liberal Extremism endangers children In a message dated 2/11/2003 8:58:40 AM Central Standard Time, owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca writes: > "It wasn't a water gun or a toy gun, it was a pistol," said Mr. Sousa. > > "I was horrified that not only were we ignored, but now my daughter is > carrying around a picture of a gun," he said. > > Mrs. Sousa then decided it was time to call the school to speak to the > principal. ..it is these type of people who whine when one day their child may be involved in a gun related incident...and then will again blame firearms for their own ignorance in not properly educating their kids in firearm safety. ..I don't know who I feel more sorry for, the stupid ingorant parents..or for the potential future child victim of those same parents own hoplophobia and ignorance. ..This is both Sad and frustrating. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:57:02 -0600 (CST) From: Bruce Mills Subject: Re: Observations from the West Coast IX KPImages wrote: > > Here's an idea for those people in Alberta looking for some answers from the > NFA. It's called Ambush Journalism. That's where you have a video camera > and follow people around asking questions. You could start at the next gun > show with your list of questions for whoever happens to show up. This video > could easily be transferred to a website for everyone to view the responses > that you get. This would work for MP's across Canada as well. > > It's called Freedom of Speech/Freedom of the Press and is protected under > the Charter, at least for now. This sort of leads into the question: how does one become a "newspaper" and/or an accredited "journalist"? Yours in Liberty, Bruce Hamilton Ontario ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 17:06:21 -0600 (CST) From: "Jeff Gurnsey" Subject: Fw: Letter to the Editor - Gun cut from spelling tests This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_006D_01C2D1F7.CA5E4C20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable sent, not published - ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Jeff Gurnsey=20 To: letters@nationalpost.com=20 Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 5:59 PM Subject: Letter to the Editor - Gun cut from spelling tests It is as much unfortunate as it is appalling that the children of = Lombardy Public School have been made the targets of political = correctness as evidenced in the National Post's article "Gun cut from = spelling tests" (Feb.11). In the article, parent Amanda Sousa states that "The word gun is = synonymous with death" and "Guns are violent. End of story". She = further states that her actions are not about political correctness. = The Upper Canada District school Board then performs a disturbing = knee-jerk reaction by bending to uneducated and intolerant beliefs by = censoring the word "gun" from the school curriculum. There are over 7 million law abiding gun owners in this country who are = clearly not violent as Mrs. Sousa infers. In fact we are blue-collar = workers, teachers, doctors, and parents of school age children who own = guns, which in some cases have been passed on for generations. And we = teach our children about firearms safety and the duties of responsible = ownership. But, it is easy to see the error in Amanda Sousa's logic. In 2001, = knives and blunt instruments were the leading cause of death in = homicides in Canada. Does this mean that baseball bats and kitchen = knives are also synonymous with death and we should further ban these = words from the school curriculum? The answer in my view is clearly no. = It would be like suggesting that cars are violent because people choose = to drive drunk. But perhaps the question that needs to be answered is why the school = board changed the rules simply because they were lobbied by one = individual whom they did not wish to "offend". Will they censor such = words as gunsmith, gun-wale, be(gun), or remove all the library books = that contain the word "gun". Where will the school board draw the line = on future requests of individuals whom want to pursue their political = agendas in the school system where our children are used as pawns? Correct me if I am wrong, but I though our children were sent to school = to learn. The school board needs to do the right thing and put back the = word "gun" in the curriculum or be held accountable for their actions. Jeff Gurnsey [Moderator's Note: Please turn off HTML/MIME and/or "quoted-printable" encoding before posting messages to the Digest - plain text only. BNM] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 17:11:18 -0600 (CST) From: Bruce Mills Subject: Re: Fw: Letter to the Editor - Gun cut from spelling tests Jeff Gurnsey wrote: > Correct me if I am wrong, but I though our children were sent to school = > to learn. The school board needs to do the right thing and put back the = > word "gun" in the curriculum or be held accountable for their actions. > > Jeff Gurnsey The obvious response is, of course, to vote out these bozos on the school board, and vote in gun friendly bozos of our own. Yours in Liberty, Bruce Hamilton Ontario ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 17:35:25 -0600 (CST) From: Vulcun1isback@aol.com Subject: Re: My Letter to the Ottawa Citizen I just had to write when I read the article concerning the Sousa's hoplophobic fears regarding firearms. Their own personal fears of firearms are truly unfounded and without merit. While I agree that they have the right as parents to choose to educate or not educate their child on firearms safety issues, attempting to ban even the word "Gun" in school says to me that these parents may require some education (and even some psychological therapy of their own) to combat their unwarranted Holplophobic fears. Amanda Sousa stated : I don't think this is an issue of political correctness. It's an issue of protecting your child from violence. Guns are violent. End of story, said Mrs. Sousa. Well Mrs.Sousa it obviously is an issue of Political Correctness for you, and banning a simple word like Gun in a spelling class, will not make your child any safer on the streets than to think that making duck hunters register their guns will stop everyday street crime. Furthermore guns are not violent in and by themselvres Mrs.Sousa...they are merely objects,it requires human intervention (and may add the type of intervention only a sick and demented mind can fathom) to form the pyschological criminal intent required to take another human beings life in cold blood. So let's place the blame where squarely where it truly belongs on criminals..not guns, or gun owners. it is criminals that are violent..not guns. Guns are used everyday by thousands of gun owners across Canada for peaceful purposes like target shooting,competitive shooting sports, and hunting. (not to mention those who merely collect firearms in the interest of historical value (just like some people collect cars,stamps,etc) I ask Mrs.Sousa to stop and think about this for a moment- The recent shooting in Ontario of the six year old boy by his seven year old sister could have been avoided by many different means, but one of those means that got no attention at all is that of Child Firearm Education .(Could this be because our government-like you has an anti-gun bias sentiment ? ) If either of those kids had been properly educated about gun safety ( as in the NRA'S Excellent Eddie Eagle Program which has educated over 6 Million kids in the US. to date and in fact is taught in many U.S. Schools Right now ) If a program such of as this existed in Canada..perhaps we wouldn't have so many Holophobic Parents running around like Mrs.Sousa. it's sad to think that the very same parents who deprive their children of proper Gun safety education are the same ones who will later again blame guns (instead of themselves) for their own ignorance. ...End of Story. Here is a link to the NRA's Eddie Eagle Program for any Educators and parents out there that really do care about their students/childs personal well being Mrs.Sousa I do respect your personal feelings and I'm positive you feel that you are Right in supporting your convictions, but those feelings seem to be based on emotionalism rather than facts and Common Sense. http://www.nra.org/modules/eddie_eagle/assets/020722%20eddie.jpg - Sincerely, -Robert A. Mazurek -Winnipeg ------------------------------ End of Cdn-Firearms Digest V5 #755 ********************************** Submissions: mailto:cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Mailing List Commands: mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Moderator's e-mail address: mailto:akimoya@sprint.ca List owner: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca FAQ list: http://www.magma.ca/~asd/cfd-faq1.html and http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/Faq/cfd-faq1.html Web Site: http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/homepage.html FTP Site: ftp://teapot.usask.ca/pub/cdn-firearms/ CFDigest Archives: http://www.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca/~ab133/ or put the next command in an e-mail message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca get cdn-firearms-digest v04.n192 end (192 is the digest issue number and 04 is the volume) To unsubscribe from _all_ the lists, put the next five lines in a message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca unsubscribe cdn-firearms-digest unsubscribe cdn-firearms-alert unsubscribe cdn-firearms-chat unsubscribe cdn-firearms end (To subscribe, use "subscribe" instead of "unsubscribe".) 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