From: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca (Cdn-Firearms Digest) To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Subject: Cdn-Firearms Digest V8 #228 Reply-To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Sender: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Errors-To: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Precedence: normal Cdn-Firearms Digest Sunday, July 17 2005 Volume 08 : Number 228 In this issue: Canada says to hunt down al-Qaeda in Afghanistan PM defends blunt general Re: Cdn-Firearms Digest V8 #227 Toronto Area Conservative Party TownHall Meeting, July 18 TYRANNY IN CANADA A Promise to Repeal the Firearms Act Re: foster kids An Idea that Merits Action letter to the Editor Re: more on the war Re: Tyrants & Genocide Why should we register Re: more on the war Re: Toronto Area Conservative Party TownHall Meeting, July 18 Re: PM defends blunt general Re: Toronto Star: Small arms inflict huge toll; 500,000 people a ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 14:22:43 -0600 (CST) From: "Bruce Mills" Subject: Canada says to hunt down al-Qaeda in Afghanistan http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N15534224.htm Canada says to hunt down al-Qaeda in Afghanistan 15 Jul 2005 14:32:44 GMT Source: Reuters (Eds: note strong language in paragraph 5) OTTAWA, July 14 (Reuters) - Canadian troops will take a more active role hunting down the "detestable murderers and scumbags" of al-Qaeda and the Taliban in southern Afghanistan next year, Canada's top military officer said in comments published on Friday. Canada is boosting its presence in Afghanistan and by next February there will be 1,500 soldiers in the southern city of Kandahar. General Rick Hillier, chief of the defense staff, said the troops would track down members of the former ruling Taliban and al-Qaeda. "We're actually going there to take down the folks who are trying to still blow up men and woman in Afghanistan and still provide a base for an organisation like al-Qaeda," newspapers quoted Hillier as saying. Hillier said troops could be killed or injured in Afghanistan but dismissed fears that a more active role for the military overseas might trigger attacks in Canada, noting that Canadians had not hesitated to fight in World War Two. "Did they say 'No, because we might be attacked over here if we actually go and stand up against those despicable murderous bastards'? No they did not," he said. "They went and did it because it was right. I think it's exactly the same thing now. We need to take a stand," he added, saying last week's bomb attacks in London showed Canada could not afford to be complacent. Hillier also confirmed that Canada's top secret Joint Task Force Two commando force would be taking part in operations in Afghanistan against al-Qaeda and the Taliban. "These are detestable murderers and scumbags, I'll tell you that right up front. They detest our freedoms, they detest our society, they detest our liberties," he said. Hillier served as the head of the NATO-led International Security Assistance Force in Kabul last year. He took over as chief of the defense staff in February this year, just weeks before the Liberal government announced a big increase in military spending. "We are the Canadian Forces, and our job is to be able to kill people," the newspapers quoted him as saying. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 14:23:48 -0600 (CST) From: "Bruce Mills" Subject: PM defends blunt general http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2005/07/15/1133695-cp.html PM defends blunt general By STEPHEN THORNE OTTAWA (CP) - If Canadians were shocked that the head of their military called his enemy "detestable murderers and scumbags," they better get used to it. Gen. Rick Hillier has never minced words, nor is he likely to start any time soon. His blunt assessment of terrorists in Afghanistan and elsewhere this week has the wholehearted backing of the prime minister. "General Hillier is not only a top soldier, he is a soldier who has served in Afghanistan," Paul Martin said Friday in Nova Scotia. "The point he is simply making is we are at war with terrorism and we're not going to let them win." Defence Minister Bill Graham's office refused Friday to soften or explain the comments of its top soldier. No "clarification" will be forthcoming, said spokesman Steven Jurgutis. "I can certainly understand that there may be people who are concerned with the tone of his statements," said Jurgutis. But he said Hillier "has certainly been a fairly straight-talking individual throughout his career. "I wouldn't say this represents a change in attitude." Defence analysts and soldiers alike lauded Hillier's appointment as chief of defence staff earlier this year as a fundamental shift in the Canadian military. Known as a soldier's soldier, Hillier is the most operationally experienced commander to take the top post in many years, breaking the bureaucratic mould that seemed to dictate many appointments since the Cold War. Born in the outport of Campbellton on Newfoundland's north coast, Hillier doesn't attempt to cover a Scottish-Irish lilt that turns "Afghanistan" into "haffghanistan" and "horse" into "orse." One factor in Hillier's promotion was his fearlessness and penchant for calling things as he sees them. The defence minister was looking for a new vision for the Canadian Forces and, in Hillier, he got it. A defence policy statement released in April charted a whole new course for defence - much of it adhering to Hillier's direction. His current list of requests for interviews is at about 50, so this week the general with the reddish-blond moustache held an informal, on-the-record media luncheon. Audiotapes were OK, cameras were banned. Reporters familiar with Hillier's style barely flinched when he said all elements of the Canadian Forces need to be revamped, including the part where "you go out and bayonet somebody." "We are not the Public Service of Canada," he declared. "We are not just another department. We are the Canadian Forces and our job is to be able to kill people." The terrorist bombings in London underscore the need to take the fight to the enemy in failed states where they have room to thrive, said Hillier. As a Western society that values rights and freedoms, Canada is already in conflict with "what people like Osama bin Laden, Mullah Omar and those others want." "These are detestable murderers and scumbags," Hillier said. "They detest our freedoms, they detest our society, they detest our liberties." It's time for Canada to take a stand, he said, just as it did 66 years ago when it joined the Second World War against the Nazis, whom he described as "those despicable, murderous bastards." The Polaris Institute, a left-leaning think tank based in Ottawa, said Friday the defence minister needs to "clarify" Hillier's "very alarming" comments. "His use of epithets such as 'scumbags' and 'killers' is reminiscent of language used by (U.S.) President (George W.) Bush and U.S. Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld," said project director Steven Staples. Taken alongside recent defence policy changes and an increase in the defence budget, Staples said they "show an unmistakable trend toward the Americanization of the Canadian Forces." Jurgutis noted that Canada was already listed as a terrorist target and he doubted Hillier's comments would change matters. Al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden declared Canada a "legitimate target" in March 2004. Adrian Gordon, executive director of the Centre for Emergency Preparedness, gave a qualified endorsement of Hillier's blunt talk. "Part of me agrees with that, part of me says that's true," Gordon said in an interview from Burlington, Ont. "But at the same time, if we're really going to deal with this problem and have a hope of putting an end to terrorism, then we have to work towards understanding the root causes, which go much deeper than current events in Iraq and Afghanistan." ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 15:31:43 -0600 (CST) From: br8boss@xcelco.on.ca Subject: Re: Cdn-Firearms Digest V8 #227 > ------------------------------ > > Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 13:32:03 -0600 (CST) > From: "ross" > Subject: BYLAWS FOR OTAWA OFFICE > > the bylaws are posted here: > > http://members.shaw.ca/FREEFALLCRUSADER/CFEI-home.htm > > Most of the coding is done, but noit all. Have a look folks, read it , talk > it up, accept it, reject it, or revise it. but do not let this opportunity > pass. > > I am reminded of a saying in Israel concerning the palestinians."they never > miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity!". > > The same can be said for the RFC...do not miss this chance . It may very > well be our last and only chance to get rid of unjust laws that have been in > place for ten years and counting. Well done ross.. It looks very professional to me! How much for membership? Hugh Evers ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 15:44:30 -0600 (CST) From: "Bruce Mills" Subject: Toronto Area Conservative Party TownHall Meeting, July 18 SPREAD THE WORD! This coming Monday there will be a townhall-style meeting featuring talks by three of the CPC's Toronto area "star" candidates, including some Q&A time. From what I have heard, the GTA Conservative candidates have not been happy with the direction the party brass has taken in the last year, and are considering throwing some weight around to get some policy changes done that will make the party more saleable to the Ontario folk. No doubt meetings like this will play a huge role in deciding what policies they want to tinker with or reconsider. If you are a CPC member, and you should be, get down there and let's remind them that civil liberties such as gun ownership are not negotiable. This is what I received: Hi everyone: Here is the plan for the Monday, July 18, Town Hall. It will be at Metro Council Chambers, 55 John Street, beginning at 7:30 pm. The agenda follows: 1) Welcome and intro of Peter Kent, Moderator - Sam Goldstein, Candidate, Trinity Spadina 2) Peter Kent will introduce the three MPs (Monte Solberg/Peter Van Loan/Steven Fletcher ) 3) The Town Hall will be divided into three segments: a) Where are we with regard to the election? b) What is the Conservative Party about (who are we)? c) What is our plan for Canada? 4) Each segment will be approximately 25 mins long. Each MP will take a segment and speak to it for about 10-12 mins. The questions will be taken from the audience for about 10-12 mins. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 17:38:26 -0600 (CST) From: Joe Subject: TYRANNY IN CANADA To say or imply that Canada is a free state, and not know Canadians live in tyranny would be a mistake. However, to say or imply that Canada is a free state when you know Canadians live in tyranny is a lie. To live in tyranny and act as though we are free, are we not living a lie? If mentioning that Canada is in tyranny is scary to the ignorant masses, then perhaps by educating those ignorant masses of this same tyranny may we change their fears into actions. These actions are necessary to provide the impetus for regaining our lost liberties. I think it is called putting your head into the sand. Yours in Tyranny, Joe Gingrich White Fox, Sask. Soviet Kanukistan (formerly Canada) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 17:38:41 -0600 (CST) From: Edward Hudson Subject: A Promise to Repeal the Firearms Act In a letter dated 08 July 2005 Garry Breitkreuz, MP Conservative Firearms Critic writes, "There is only one way to fix this mess and that is to elect a Conservative government. We promise to repeal Bill C-68 and return gun laws to the way they were before 1995. Then I personally promise that I will start the task of fixing all the flaws in federal firearms laws by including a sunset clause on all gun control laws that have been proven by the Auditor General not to be cost effective at reducing the criminal use of firearms and improving public safety." These two promises, plus the new policy of the Conservative Party of Canada, represent a major step towards a Firearms Prohibition Registry ( a registry of only persons prohibited by the courts from possessing and acquiring firearms) which would be a sane, reasonable, and effective means to promote the safety of all Canadians. Sincerely, Eduardo CUFOA ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 17:39:08 -0600 (CST) From: Bill Farion Subject: Re: foster kids Hi; Well this jury had better come up with lots of foster homes! My guns come before someone elses brat! >A coroner's jury examining the death of a Nackawic-area youth is calling for >more firearms restrictions in New Brunswick foster homes. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 21:08:53 -0600 (CST) From: Edward Hudson Subject: An Idea that Merits Action On 2005 Jul 16, at 3:56 PM, Edward Hudson wrote: > In a letter dated 08 July 2005 Garry Breitkreuz, MP Conservative > Firearms Critic writes, In his letter Mr Breitkreuz also stated: "The Auditor General announced that she will be doing a update on her December 2002 Report on the Cost of Implementing the Canadian Firearms Program. She will report in February 2006. We continue to press her for a value-for-money audit and ask you to do the same." Perhaps our Auditor General will be more responsive to our requests for action than is our Prime Minister. At least Mr Breitkreuz has an idea worthy of our action. Sincerely, Eduardo CUFOA ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 21:25:58 -0600 (CST) From: "M.J. Ackermann, MD" Subject: letter to the Editor Please tell me why there is a recommendation to remove legally owned and safely stored firearms from foster parents' homes when there is no similar call to remove automobiles? This knee-jerk reaction follows the recent inquest into the suicide of a New brunswick teen who abused a legally stored rifle she stole by first stealing the keys to her foster parents' gun locker. As you know, a trio of "troubled" teens stole their social worker's car this weekend and crashed it in PEI, killing the 14 year old driver. In the 10 -19 age group more than 480 kids die annually as a result of motor vehicle crashes. Compare this to 104 firearm deaths of which 75 are suicides (1) and one is left to wonder why the guns get the disproportionate response. It is also well documented that suicide rates do not at all correlate to the availability of firearms. When there are no guns suicidal people simply use other means. (2) Each death is tragic, but needlessly curtailing the lawful activities of shooting sports enthusiasts will do little to stop the criminally malicious or the suicidal from abusing or causing harm with firearms or any other household item for that matter. If we were to apply the same "logic" to all potentially dangerous tools, then no foster home should have rope, water, kitchen knives, bathtubs, barbecues, etc. If I had to choose between a troubled teen and my gun collection, the kid would have to go. Unlike a severely maladjusted person, the guns cannot act of their own volition to cause harm. Left to their own devices, they are inert. - -- M.J. Ackermann, MD (Mike) Foster Parent Rural Family Physician, Sherbrooke, NS Secretary, St. Mary's Shooters Association Member All For Horses Association, Nova Scotia Equestrian Federation Box 13, 120 Cameron Rd. Sherbrooke, NS Canada B0J 3C0 902-522-2172 My email: mikeack@ns.sympatico.ca My Bio: http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/mikeack/mikeack.htm SMSA URL: www.smsa.ca "Hope for the best, but plan for the worst". References: 1) Statistics Canada Cat. no. 84F0209XIB Mortality-Summary List of Causes, 1997 Shelf Tables 2) Children and Guns: Sensible Solutions By David Kopel, 1993 http://rkba.org/research/kopel/kids-gun.html#suicide ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2005 01:46:07 -0600 (CST) From: Rick Lowe Subject: Re: more on the war "Todd Birch" wrote: > It has always been the policy of the US for citizens to support it's wars or > shut up. That's been the case since the days of Teddy's "Great White Fleet" > gun boat dipomacy when the US first became a global power. Paraphrasing John > Wayne - "America, love it or leave it." That's not correct. There were a lot of citizens who spoke out against involvement in WWI, WWII, and Vietnam. Presidents of the day long heard opposition to involvement in those wars, and it took fairly dramatic events to finally turn the tide and get the US into the first two wars. As for John Wayne, while others in Hollywood put their careers aside to go in harm's way and fight wars... John Wayne elected to stay home and make hero movies about going to fight wars. John Wayne didn't know much about serving his country out of patriotic love, unfortunately... BTW, the British were the ones who invented the concentration camp, and Canadian soldiers helped to fill those camps. Tens of thousands of Boer women, children, and old people died in those camps. - -- "We sleep safe in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm." George Orwell ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2005 01:46:53 -0600 (CST) From: Rick Lowe Subject: Re: Tyrants & Genocide Edward Hudson wrote: > Are we Canadians so different that what afflicts the other 99.9% of the > world will not afflict us also ?? > We SHOULD speak of tyranny. > We SHOULD speak of genocide. > We have a responsibility to talk about these "uncomfortable" subjects. > To do otherwise is to shirk our responsibility as citizens. > > Until we have effected the repeal of the entire Firearms Act and have > ensured that licensing is a "dead" issue, we are not safe in Canada. That's interesting. Let's presume many of our readers who are outraged about the Firearms Act are about 60 years old. When Doukabour children were being torn from their families to be "properly" raised by the government, our outraged freedom fighters were of voting age at the time. Did they fight against that wrong or shrug their shoulders because it didn't affect them and it had nothing to do with firearms? When Tom Campbell was having city police trying to run the hippies out of Vancouver and violating just about all their civil rights, were our freedom fighters of today screaming in outrage about what was being done to the hippies? Or did they say nothing, because it had nothing to do with firearms and perhaps they didn't like hippies to begin with? The War Measures Act. How many of our anti-Firearms Act freedom fighters spoke out loudly against that at the time, because it had nothing to do with our access to and use of firearms? These aren't the only instances of course. There have been many instances over the last 40 years that, if we REALLY were all about freedom and rights, we would have been sounding off long before the Firearms Act came into being. Freedom and just treatment for Canadians has been under attack for long before the Firearms Act was ever passed. How many of us "shirked our responsibilities as citizens" during those times? For most of us, it isn't about rights, freedoms, fair government, or anything else, no matter what we say. All it's about is that changes in public opinion finally got around to us. Until firearms laws caught up with us, we really didn't give a damn. - -- "We sleep safe in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm." George Orwell ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2005 09:12:26 -0600 (CST) From: "ross" Subject: Why should we register The gangbangers who kill and shoot up Toronto skyline dont get jail sentences for not registering their guns.. So why is it again that the honest schmuck should go out and register?? Oh yeah..i forgot.. the NWEST troopers will kick down your door and seize your property ...not because you were out shooting up the town....but because you didnt register your guns. Seems to me the NWEST hammer and swta teams could better use their time, and resources to kick down the criminals doors..... then again, we dont shoot back now do we. Law abiding citizens...the soft easily attacked underbelly of society..... the target ofr government stooges and enforces worldwide. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2005 09:13:02 -0600 (CST) From: "mred" Subject: Re: more on the war - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rick Lowe" To: Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 3:46 AM Subject: Re: more on the war > "Todd Birch" wrote: unfortunately... > BTW, the British were the ones who invented the concentration camp, and > Canadian soldiers helped to fill those camps. Tens of thousands of Boer > women, children, and old people died in those camps. - --This is something they never taught us in school? where can I get more information on this subject ? TIA ed/ontario ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2005 09:13:40 -0600 (CST) From: "mred" Subject: Re: Toronto Area Conservative Party TownHall Meeting, July 18 So whats to stop the elected candidate from "defecting" to the Liberal party a la Stronach?Once theyre elected to parliament ? I am really quite leary of any new additions to the PC party at this point in time.Primarily because we dont know how dedicated they are to PC principles. Defected =euphemism for "sell out" ed/ontario ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2005 09:15:20 -0600 (CST) From: "mred" Subject: Re: PM defends blunt general Nothing new in this ? The enemy on both sides has been called that or worse ? Depends on which side you`re on.And lest we forget ? They all pray to the same GOD? What surprises me though ? Is the fact the left wing Lieberals would appoint a strong right-winger as chief of staff? I wonder what their secret agenda is?Perhaps to bolster the moral and zeal,of Canadian troops , when it comes time to march gun-owners into concentration camps ? And they can do this , much as they marched Canadian citizens into concentration camps in WW11 and stole all their property My concern in all this terrorism hoo-rah ? Is why they dont do this to all the Muslims? at least they would know where they are ?and any new ones would stand out like a sore thumb and be easy to apprehend before they did any harm. Sure, theres some good Muslims? just as there were good Canadian born citizens incarcerated in WW11. ed/ontario ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2005 09:16:23 -0600 (CST) From: "mred" Subject: Re: Toronto Star: Small arms inflict huge toll; 500,000 people a year Sender: owner-cdn-firearms@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Precedence: normal Reply-To: cdn-firearms@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca > PUBLICATION: The Toronto Star > DATE: 2005.07.16 > EDITION: ONT > SECTION: News > PAGE: A9 > BYLINE: Olivia Ward > ILLUSTRATION: Heidi Bradner Panos Pictures The proliferation of > illegallytraded small arms is fuelling conflicts around the world. The > United Nations is working to stem the tide. > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- > ---- > > Small arms inflict huge toll; 500,000 people a year are killed by portable > weapons such as handguns, rifles, grenades and bombs Canada supports > United > Nations treaty to reduce the illegal flow of arms to world's conflict > zones > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- > ---- > > With each new terrorist attack, world leaders warn of the danger of > weapons > of mass destruction, which could devastate entire continents in the hands > of > malevolent militants. > > The threat posed by unconventional weapons can't be underestimated. But > those who study worldwide violence say the real and present danger is not > the technically complex, expensive and hard-to-obtain nuclear, chemical > and > biological weapons, but small arms, which have proliferated in the past > half > century to kill millions of innocent people. > > "Everyday terrorism is linked with small arms," says Keith Krause, program > director of the Geneva-based Small Arms Survey. "Most attacks are done > locally, and local people are targeted. You don't need a high degree of > sophistication if you want to kill." Instead of disarming local people ? ARM them and let then defend themselves.If this report is true then its criminals who are doing the shooting, not law-abiding citizens. If the CCW laws don't teach us anything else ? its that the law abiding citizen should be armed to defend himself and family against criminals of any type, not take their guns away as the UN did in Bosnia and elsewhere, and leave them open to mass slaughter. In my opinion this is just an excuse for the UN to get on the disarmament bandwagon of law-abiding citizens world-wide ? so that they can eventually dominate all countries.(Only the police and military will have guns ) Where only the police and military have guns ? , events have shown that the governments involved are or quickly become absolute dictatorships by force of arms. ed/ontario ------------------------------ End of Cdn-Firearms Digest V8 #228 ********************************** Submissions: mailto:cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Mailing List Commands: mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Moderator's e-mail address: mailto:akimoya@cogeco.ca List owner: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca FAQ list: http://www.magma.ca/~asd/cfd-faq1.html and http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/Faq/cfd-faq1.html Web Site: http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/homepage.html FTP Site: ftp://teapot.usask.ca/pub/cdn-firearms/ CFDigest Archives: http://www.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca/~ab133/ or put the next command in an e-mail message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca get cdn-firearms-digest v04.n192 end (192 is the digest issue number and 04 is the volume) To unsubscribe from _all_ the lists, put the next five lines in a message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca unsubscribe cdn-firearms-digest unsubscribe cdn-firearms-alert unsubscribe cdn-firearms-chat unsubscribe cdn-firearms end (To subscribe, use "subscribe" instead of "unsubscribe".) 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