From: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca (Cdn-Firearms Digest) To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Subject: Cdn-Firearms Digest V8 #316 Reply-To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Sender: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Errors-To: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Precedence: normal Cdn-Firearms Digest Wednesday, August 10 2005 Volume 08 : Number 316 In this issue: Re: wendy gets more press Re: Cdn-Firearms Digest V8 #315 NO FLY LIST Editorial: No-fly list is a bad idea for Canada Youth had a 'hit-list' and a cache of weapons Privacy watchdog critical of 'no fly' EDITOR (Guess which of the two they're more afraid of) COLUMN: FIGHT GUN VIOLENCE: SCRAP THE REGISTRY Number of guns from U.S. unknown; Letter: I'd rather be a criminal than register my guns ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 05:19:19 -0600 (CST) From: "mred" Subject: Re: wendy gets more press Yes I do give me some time to find it again...ed/ontario - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Keith de Solla" > mred wrote: >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "10x" <10x@telus.net> > >> I believe it was in 1993 that the Kanadian government passed a law > allowing >> them to sieze all personal property including RRSP`s and bank accounts > etc >> . >> to pay off any debts..........so a few guns is immaterial to them >> ed/ontario > > > Do you have any more details on this law? Yes I do give me some time to find it again...ed/ontario ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:24:52 -0600 (CST) From: "M.J. Ackermann, MD" Subject: Re: Cdn-Firearms Digest V8 #315 Any Toronto area gun owners on this list? Time to start your own billboard and newspaper ad campaign. Don't wait for anyone else to do it for you. Get at it NOW if you want to have an effect. - -- M.J. Ackermann, MD (Mike) Rural Family Physician, Sherbrooke, NS Secretary, St. Mary's Shooters Association Member All For Horses Association, Nova Scotia Equestrian Federation Box 13, 120 Cameron Rd. Sherbrooke, NS Canada B0J 3C0 902-522-2172 My email: mikeack@ns.sympatico.ca My Bio: http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/mikeack/mikeack.htm SMSA URL: www.smsa.ca "Hope for the best, but plan for the worst". ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:25:11 -0600 (CST) From: "ross" Subject: NO FLY LIST Federal Privacy Commissioner Jennifer Stoddart said despite assurances from the government, she has not yet received an indepth briefing about the initiative. Last week, Ottawa announced the plan for creating a no-fly list of people who pose "an immediate threat to aviation security" as part of its security upgrade. Names would be added to the list based on information supplied by CSIS and the RCMP. Data would also be shared with American and British security officials. CAN THE RCMP AND CSIS BE TRUSTED BY CANADIANS TO GET THIS NO FLY LIST RIGHT. One need only look to maher Arar to see that they screwed up royally, and now hide behind "national security" in order not to answer questions and hide documents. These same people destroyed documents, lose laptops and other such things which do not instill confidence. then again how many billions will a database of no fly lists cost the taxpayers. If the firearms registry cost 2 billion, the price tag ona no fly list should be a whopper. But the original question still applies. can either of these two groups be trusted? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:27:33 -0600 (CST) From: Breitkreuz@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca, Garry - Assistant 1 Subject: Editorial: No-fly list is a bad idea for Canada PUBLICATION: The Toronto Star DATE: 2005.08.10 EDITION: ONT SECTION: Editorial PAGE: A18 ILLUSTRATION: Jean Lapierre WORD COUNT: 415 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ No-fly list is a bad idea for Canada - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Let's pretend it's mid-January and you and the family have turned up at Pierre Elliott Trudeau airport with skis and snowboards, headed for Whistler Mountain. But when you check in for your flight to Vancouver, the man behind the counter rattles your name into a computer, gazes at the screen and says "Sorry, you're on the no-fly list. You can't board the plane." There's no appeal, no way to find out why you're on the list or who put you on it, and no way to check if it's a mistake. You're stuck. Even allowing security personnel to ransack your luggage and conduct full body searches will change nothing. Transport Minister Jean Lapierre insists that this little mid-winter nightmare will never happen when Canada introduces its no-fly list next year. He told the Gazette's editorial board that the list will be short - - no more than 1,000 names - and will have "no good guys" on it. We are not convinced. Lapierre was notably fuzzy about what criteria he would use to assemble the list, so it's unclear how he could be so certain that only 1,000 people in the entire world would qualify for inclusion. That would barely cover the leaders of Hamas and Al Qaeda. No one wants a long and easily abused list like the U.S. one, but a short one would seem to offer little protection. But even useful no-fly lists are abusive. They might serve a purpose for flights originating abroad; Canada does, after all, have a right to refuse entry to non-citizens, for whatever reason we deem suitable. But within the country, it should be unacceptable to limit the freedom of citizens and residents without informing them or offering them an opportunity to defend themselves against such a sanction. In fact, the only Canadian residents who should qualify to be on such a list are people who are subject to arrest or deportation anyway. People like that should be on a "most wanted" list, and if they try to get on an airplane they should be apprehended, not simply told they can't board the flight but could always try VIA Rail. This is an idea Lapierre should drop. It's simply a distraction, and arguing about it could delay more useful measures, such as adding more dirty-bomb detection devices at ports and airports, and installing more cameras in subways and buses. This is an edited version of an editorial that appeared in the Gazette, Montreal. Worth Repeating ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:28:05 -0600 (CST) From: Breitkreuz@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca, Garry - Assistant 1 Subject: Youth had a 'hit-list' and a cache of weapons PUBLICATION: The Moncton Times and Transcript DATE: 2005.08.10 SECTION: News PAGE: A3 COLUMN: Courts/Crime BYLINE: Times & Transcript Staff DATELINE: MIRAMICHI WORD COUNT: 195 - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ----- Teen pleads guilty to 'hit-list' threats - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ----- A Neguac-area youth who had a 'hit-list' and a cache of weapons will be sentenced in September on two counts of uttering threats. The youth's four-day trial was supposed to begin yesterday but the 15-year-old changed his pleas to guilty in front of Judge William MacCarroll. The youth, who can't be identified under provisions of the Youth Criminal Justice Act, was arrested in May for making threats on May 3-6. The RCMP arrested him after a student complained to the Miramichi Police Force that a third party told them they were being threatened. The third party got the information from an Internet chat-line. The RCMP seized a computer hard-drive from the home of the 15-year-old, along with several firearms, knives and a hit-list of about 40 names, all students at Miramichi Valley High School. Cpl. Marc Beaupré of the Neguac RCMP said two other people, one adult and one youth, still face charges in relation to this matter. As a result of the RCMP investigation of the first teen, a second Neguac-area boy, 16, was also arrested on one count of uttering threats. His trial will take place in December. An adult also faces one count of unsafe storage of firearms, a charge he will answer to on Sept. 15 in Neguac provincial court. Judge MacCarroll ordered a pre-sentence report and victim impact statements for the 15-year-old. He set sentencing for Sept. 16. The youth has been in custody for three months. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:28:12 -0600 (CST) From: Breitkreuz@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca, Garry - Assistant 1 Subject: Privacy watchdog critical of 'no fly' PUBLICATION: National Post DATE: 2005.08.10 EDITION: National SECTION: Canada PAGE: A5 COLUMN: National Report BYLINE: Joel Kom SOURCE: CanWest News Service DATELINE: MONTREAL ILLUSTRATION: Colour Photo: Jennifer Stoddart. WORD COUNT: 225 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Privacy watchdog critical of 'no fly' - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ MONTREAL - The no-fly list announced last week that would keep a record of passengers banned from air travel in Canada breaks privacy boundaries that were previously untouched in Canada, the privacy commissioner of Canada said yesterday. Responding to Transport Minister Jean Lapierre's outline of a no-fly list in Halifax on Friday, Jennifer Stoddart said the list is a serious breach of privacy rights. And while security measures plunge ahead in the wake of the London bombings, privacy continues to lag behind, she added. "We're going ahead with very privacy-intrusive measures when the protection of privacy is a generation behind in Canada," Ms. Stoddart said in a telephone interview. Among Ms. Stoddart's main concerns are the justification for the list and the criteria for being placed on it. Mr. Lapierre has said only that someone who poses "an immediate threat" would go on the list. To get someone on the list, Ms. Stoddart said, that person would have to be watched and personal files would have to be searched. Ms. Stoddart also pointed to the lack of recourse for someone whose name is added to the list. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:29:14 -0600 (CST) From: Breitkreuz@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca, Garry - Assistant 1 Subject: EDITOR (Guess which of the two they're more afraid of) PUBLICATION: The Toronto Sun DATE: 2005.08.10 EDITION: Final SECTION: Editorial/Opinion PAGE: 18 COLUMN: Letters to the Editor WORD COUNT: 637 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ LETTERS TO THE EDITOR COLUMN - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ I REMEMBER telling my wife the day after Mike Harris was elected and then proceeded to cut welfare by 25% that down the road 10 or 12 years we would pay a heavy price for the tax cuts we all received on the back of the poorest in our society. The children who were 10 or 12 then are now the 20-year-olds on the streets today. Hunger, the lack of a decent home, lack of clothes, sports etc., can make a good child a very angry child. Before you lay all the blame on the doorstep of the federal Liberals, take a long hard look at the crisis you and your neocons have created. Calvin Harrington EDITOR (What a collossal insult to all law-abiding welfare recipients!) IT'S ALL too predictable that Mayor David Miller and other members of the leftist plague that fouls our otherwise fair city would blame Mike Harris for their own problems (Christina Blizzard, Aug. 9). The fact is that in 2000, Statistics Canada tells us that Ontario's murder rate had fallen to 1.3 per 100,000 -- the lowest since 1963, and far lower than the national average. We are only seeing a spike in violence in Toronto, not throughout the province. Should we not blame the profligate tax-and-spend policies of our own city for causing businesses to flee, and subsequently denying many young people the chance at a good job? Would not there be plenty of money for youth programs had not Miller and his cabal agreed to such generous pay hikes to "buy labour peace"? Joshua Albert Toronto EDITOR (Good question) MEL LASTMAN called in the army to clear away snow. I think we should call in the army -- send them to the most dangerous areas of Toronto and do a house-to-house search. Come on, Mayor Miller, make a clean sweep of gun violence. Remember, power comes not only from a gun but from those who vote. Joseph William Lea Etobicoke EDITOR (Last time we checked, a mayor didn't have that kind of power. See below) OUR MAYOR and premier say they will get serious about gun crime, and raise the issue of smuggling from the U.S. as a distraction -- to blame the Americans for our problems. This is nothing but empty talk. Several months ago police in Brampton acted on a tip and set up a cordon to search patrons leaving a nightclub for illegal weapons. The judge threw out the charges laid because the police had unreasonably infringed people's rights. The logic was apparently that police could only search without a warrant if a serious crime was involved. As long as our courts feel that possession of illegal firearms is not a serious crime, nothing the police do will have any meaning. If our political leaders are serious about crime, they need to put pressure on our courts, not the U.S. ambassador. Brian Smith Toronto EDITOR (Guess which of the two they're more afraid of) EVERYONE IS shocked lately at the rash of gun violence and the murders in Toronto. Honestly, what should we all expect from a government whose top priority is to waste the taxpayers' time and money on useless legislation? Look at all the energy and passion spent on banning pit bulls over the past year -- legislation that won't protect anyone from dog attacks or the irresponsible owners who are the true root of the problem. When will the government start placing the blame on the people behind the guns, the knives and the dogs and finally do something productive to protect us all from the real dangers of our society? When will the Premier and the Attorney General start directing that same passion into something that will actually work for us? Jody Robson Barrie EDITOR (You mean like hiring more cops, as they promised?) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:29:39 -0600 (CST) From: Breitkreuz@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca, Garry - Assistant 1 Subject: COLUMN: FIGHT GUN VIOLENCE: SCRAP THE REGISTRY PUBLICATION: The Toronto Sun DATE: 2005.08.10 EDITION: Final SECTION: Editorial/Opinion PAGE: 19 BYLINE: PETER WORTHINGTON, TORONTO SUN COLUMN: Write Stuff WORD COUNT: 477 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ FIGHT GUN VIOLENCE: SCRAP THE REGISTRY - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ HOW MANY times have we gone over this -- gun violence and gun registration and how the two have little relevance to each other? The media, politicians, police and public all agree that something must be done to halt the increasing tendency towards gun violence in Toronto -- especially handgun violence, which has had strict regulations and controls since 1934. It's a familiar refrain. Yet little is achieved. There's no mystical secret on how to curb the use of guns, but our society simply isn't willing to do what works. Clearly, what doesn't work is gun registration. That reality is painfully obvious, yet those who bray the loudest against all firearms are often the ones most aggressively opposed to what may reduce firearm violence. Take Toronto, where we all share varying degrees of outrage and unease over 22 shootings in barely two weeks. The Sun editorializes on the subject, as does the National Post and other papers -- all sensibly, but all missing key points. In Toronto, most of the victims of shootings are black; most of the shooters are black. Black community and church leaders are urging people to come forward and help the police -- something many have understandably been reluctant to do, fearing reprisals. Yet gun violence is more than a "black problem" -- as every black citizen knows. Toronto's gun-gang problem is largely imported from crime-plagued Jamaica, where many of the shooters are from. Until recently, this has been unmentionable in Toronto. Racial profiling, and all that. Police know it, the posturing Mayor David Miller knows it, as does dithering Dalton McGuinty. But will any of them acknowledge it? Not bloody likely! So law-abiding Toronto black citizens (including the majority of Jamaicans) continue to be victimized by other blacks, many if not most of whom are linked to Jamaica. Some who've been deported later re-emerge in Canada. The most favoured deterrent is mandatory prison sentences for using a gun in a crime. How is that a deterrent when it isn't implemented? Too often, the existing "mandatory" sentence for using a gun in a crime gets plea-bargained away. For shame. Toronto's political leaders wonder at how New York changed under Rudy Giuliani from being America's most lethal and crime-ridden city into the safest city for its size. But our leaders dare not try Giuliani's formula here. BEGGARS REVERED Giuliani did it by cracking down on all lawbreaking -- from littering, vagrancy and innumerable petty offences to murder. The payoff from fingerprinting and identifying minor criminals was that in major crimes, many fingerprints matched and the police had leads. Meanwhile, in Toronto, beggars, squeegee people et al. are not only tolerated but practically revered. Not a great way to purge crime and criminals. When gun violence becomes endemic, there is also the solution invoked by Florida, Texas and 40-plus other states -- allowing honest citizens to carry concealed weapons. To the surprise of everyone, gun crimes dropped precipitously in those states. Lowlifes considering shooting up a McDonald's for kicks were deterred by the prospect that a Big Mac customer with a concealed gun might very well shoot them. That would never wash in Canada, least of all in Toronto, but it might deter gun crimes here as it has in the U.S. Some think more police would deter gun violence. Unlikely. More practical would be ending long-gun registration, and using the billion dollars saved to change laws so that violent criminals are easily jailed and/or deported; or, put bluntly, themselves shot by police. The choice is ours. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:30:15 -0600 (CST) From: Breitkreuz@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca, Garry - Assistant 1 Subject: Number of guns from U.S. unknown; PUBLICATION: The Toronto Star DATE: 2005.08.10 EDITION: MET SECTION: News PAGE: B2 BYLINE: Stan Josey SOURCE: Toronto Star WORD COUNT: 360 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Number of guns from U.S. unknown; Law agencies lack smuggling stats Are 'snowbirds' bringing firearms? - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Canadian border agents have seized 5,446 guns at U.S. crossings over the last five years. How many of these guns were destined for Toronto and how many got through without being detected remain matters of speculation, officials say. Mayor David Miller and police Chief Bill Blair said this week that more has to be done to prevent the flow of guns across the border since 50 per cent of the firearms used in crime here come from the United States. Miller said he wants the federal government to do more. Federal officials, however, say they are catching many weapons at the border but cannot estimate how many are getting through. "Our commitment to protecting the border is paramount, including detecting and intercepting firearms," Canada Border Services Agency spokeswoman Patrizia Giolti said yesterday. The first line in the fight against the flow of guns into Canada falls to that agency, formerly Customs and Immigration, which in turn receives help from the Integrated Border Enforcement Teams, staffed by RCMP officers, U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms officers, and local and provincial police. They use gun- and explosive-seeking dogs and a lot of intelligence work in their fight to keep firearms out of Canada. Miller said he had received information from police that guns are even being brought back to Canada by "snowbirds" who winter in the southern U.S. But Giolti said she could not confirm that because the border agency does not keep statistics on who is smuggling the guns. In Ontario, controlling the illegal gun trade is the mandate of the Provincial Weapons Enforcement Unit, which includes representatives of the Ontario Provincial Police and 11 other law-enforcement agencies. OPP Det. Insp. Steve Clegg, who heads the 42-member provincial unit, said illegal handguns sell on the street for between $1,500 and $2,000 each. Both of these task forces work closely with the National Weapons Enforcement Support Team, a federal-level effort directed by the RCMP that provides backup for police across the country against smuggling and trafficking of illegal guns. RCMP Staff Sgt. Paul Marsh said the federal resources devoted to catching smugglers at the Canada-U.S. border have increased "dramatically" since the mid-1990s and especially since the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks. He wouldn't reveal how many officers patrol borders. Marsh could not estimate how many guns are getting across the border and making their way into the hands of criminals. Giolti said her agency could not provide statistics on the types of firearms seized. All are turned over to the Mounties for disposal and the laying of any criminal charges. - ---------------------------------------- RCMP SAY THEY HAVE NO RECORDS TO SUPPORT NWEST STATISTICS ON GUN SMUGGLING http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/news/newinfo2005.htm ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:30:35 -0600 (CST) From: Breitkreuz@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca, Garry - Assistant 1 Subject: Letter: I'd rather be a criminal than register my guns PUBLICATION: Vancouver Sun DATE: 2005.08.10 EDITION: Final SECTION: Editorial PAGE: A13 COLUMN: Soundoff BYLINE: James Pocklington SOURCE: Vancouver Sun WORD COUNT: 188 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ I'd rather be a criminal than register my guns - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ I was shocked to receive a directive in the mail that I had to renew my "Possession Only" registration for two small .22-calibre guns. The government demanded a $60 reregistration fee (more than the guns are worth) and another photograph to issue a new registration. I made the error of following the new law and registered my firearms five years ago. Now, for no apparent reason, they are demanding I fill out another bunch of forms and pay another fee. Is this the way the government intends to waste another $1 billion of law-abiding citizens' taxes? Contained in the letter is a threat that, if the registration is not renewed immediately, I would be criminally responsible for having guns without a valid registration. Also, if I was slow in registering and paying the $60 fee, I could not renew without taking a special course designed for new gun owners. What a complete farce. I do not intend to continue this ridiculous charade any further. So this fall, I will become a criminal possessing guns that I have owned for over 45 years. James Pocklington West Vancouver - --------------------------------------------------------------- BACKGROUND INFORMATION Many of 1.2 million firearm owners are receiving licence renewal notices from the Canada Firearms Centre with a request for more fees. They are asking why they have to pay when many of their neighbours got their licences renewed for free. If the gun registry is really a public safety program then the public should pay the full cost - not off-loaded by the Liberals on to the backs of law-abiding firearms owners. October 26, 2004 - GARRY BREITKREUZ'S QUESTION: Liberal brain trust over there is giving away free firearms licences to 770,000 randomly selected gun owners... http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/questions/oct-26-2004.htm The Moncton Times and Transcript Column: More hassles with licensing of firearms http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publications/Article468.htm Le Soleil Column: Ottawa applying the Firearms Act by means of a discriminatory lottery http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publications/Article467.htm Saskatoon Star Phoenix: Gun registration lottery unconstitutional: Sask. MP http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publications/Article449.htm GOVERNMENT RESPONSE TO ORDER PAPER QUESTION Q-54 RESPONSE: FIREARMS CENTRE LOSES TRACK OF 46,509 MORE FIREARM LICENCE HOLDERS! http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publications/Article525.htm NATIONAL POST: Firearms centre loses track of 46,000 gun owners: http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publications/Article534.htm ------------------------------ End of Cdn-Firearms Digest V8 #316 ********************************** Submissions: mailto:cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Mailing List Commands: mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Moderator's e-mail address: mailto:akimoya@cogeco.ca List owner: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca FAQ list: http://www.magma.ca/~asd/cfd-faq1.html and http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/Faq/cfd-faq1.html Web Site: http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/homepage.html FTP Site: ftp://teapot.usask.ca/pub/cdn-firearms/ CFDigest Archives: http://www.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca/~ab133/ or put the next command in an e-mail message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca get cdn-firearms-digest v04.n192 end (192 is the digest issue number and 04 is the volume) To unsubscribe from _all_ the lists, put the next five lines in a message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca unsubscribe cdn-firearms-digest unsubscribe cdn-firearms-alert unsubscribe cdn-firearms-chat unsubscribe cdn-firearms end (To subscribe, use "subscribe" instead of "unsubscribe".) 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