From: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca (Cdn-Firearms Digest) To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Subject: Cdn-Firearms Digest V10 #391 Reply-To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Sender: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Errors-To: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Precedence: normal Cdn-Firearms Digest Wednesday, April 11 2007 Volume 10 : Number 391 In this issue: Re: Letter to Globe (just sent) ... did you know Fw: Toying around with criminal firearms [US] Hawai'i part of study linking suicide, gun ownership Get Involved, Help Win the Case What gun control didn't do for Canada Re: [US] Hawai'i part of study linking suicide, gun ownership Re: "Holocaust deniers" The Bill of Rights Test [BLOG] Guns, Fraud, and Big Numbers in Canada News Release: Proposal for firearms amnesty ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 10:54:58 -0400 From: "mred" Subject: Re: Letter to Globe (just sent) ... - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob Sciuk" To: "Canadian Firearms Digest" Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2007 9:19 AM Subject: Letter to Globe (just sent) ... > Long-gun owners get one-year reprieve ... (fwd) > Bifg deal ?/`!!!! Its smoke and mirrors to get the lawful minority gun-owners on their side for the next election which will be called in a matter of days if not a few weeks . THE CPC HAS NOT ADDRESSED THE THORN IN THE SIDE OF THE LAWFUL RFC, NAMELY C-21 , WHICH STILL REGISTERS LEGAL FIREARMS THROUGH THE CFO OF ANY PROVINCE .. If they think they are pulling the wool over the eyes of the RFC they better think again. Total elimination of any gun registry by lawful citizens is the ONLY solution, to gain our support. Register criminals dammit,not legal gun owners.. ed/ontario ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 09:57:17 -0500 From: Joe Gingrich Subject: did you know http://www.nraila.org/ Since 1991, the number of privately owned firearms in the U.S. has increased by 65-70 million, the number of right-to-carry states has increased from 15 to 40, and violent crime has decreased 38%. nra ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 08:57:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Barry Glasgow Subject: Fw: Toying around with criminal firearms The fact that Attorney General Michael Bryant is applauding Oshawa's toy gun ban shows it for the nonsense that it is. The same mentality he used to blame law-abiding gun owners for criminal gun violence is now being used to blame children's toys for the actions of hoodlums. And he's doing it for the same reason as Oshawa's mayor, John Gray - pretending to address gun crime while wasting justice resources to accomplish exactly nothing. When will Ontarians smarten up and toss these thug-huggers out of office? Barry Glasgow 4041 Torbolton Ridge Rd. RR#2, Woodlawn, Ontario Canada K0A 3M0 Phone: 613-832-2449 - ----- Forwarded Message ---- From: Barry Glasgow To: reporter905@rogers.com Cc: jgray@oshawa.ca; media@drps.ca; frearms@drps.ca; ON Hamilton Spectator ; ON Hamilton Spectator ; ON Toronto Globe & Mail ; ON Toronto Star ; ON Toronto Sun Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2007 10:24:04 AM Subject: Toying around with criminal firearms [permission to print this, in whole or in part, is granted - Barry Glasgow] Regarding Oshawa's push to ban imitation guns, I couldn't help thinking back to the days when we played cops and robbers or cowboys and Indians without worrying about getting shot by a cop. What has changed so much that makes police incapable of knowing the difference between child's play and criminal intent? I would say maybe they are more concerned about their own safety than anything else. This past week, one of three cops responding to a domestic call panicked and killed a knife-wielding drunk in the middle of a Renfrew street despite having other options to deal with the situation. No wonder they don't want kids playing with toy guns. Oshawa mayor, John Gray claims the issue is of such concern that his police are complaining about "the great difficulty that they could be faced with in the future, if staring a down a replica gun". It's really quite simple, existing laws already accommodate this. If someone uses a gun, imitation or not, in a crime then treat it as as if it's a real gun - end of story. Anyone who stops to wonder whether it might be a toy could end up dead. And if a street thug is crazy enough to point a fake gun at a cop then natural selection should remove him from the gene pool. Mayor Gray is hoping to score points with the same asinine, politically-correct nonsense used in Scugog. Someone should ask the Mayor to legally define which toy guns look too much like guns. ====================== Barry Glasgow 4041 Torbolton Ridge Rd. RR#2, Woodlawn, Ontario Canada K0A 3M0 Phone: 613-832-2449 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 12:10:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Bruce Mills Subject: [US] Hawai'i part of study linking suicide, gun ownership http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2007/Apr/10/br/br7135986204.html Hawai'i part of study linking suicide, gun ownership By LUKE TIMMERMAN Bloomberg News Service Updated at 3:11 p.m., Tuesday, April 10, 2007 Suicide, the third-leading cause of death among Americans 15 to 24 years old, is more common in U.S. states with higher rates of gun ownership, according to researchers at the Harvard School of Public Health. Twice as many people committed suicide from 2000 to 2002 in the 15 states with the highest rates of gun ownership, compared with the six states where guns are least common, according to the study published in the April issue of the Journal of Trauma. The population in both groups was about the same, the study said. Hawai'i was among the six states where gun ownership is least common. Suicide is the eighth leading cause of death among U.S. men, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention's Web Site. The higher suicide rates in the Harvard study were found in men, women and children of all ages in states where more households have guns. "We found that where there are more guns, there are more suicides," said Matthew Miller, assistant professor of health policy and management at Harvard School of Public Health, in a statement. Miller was lead author of the study. Miller and colleagues used survey data to estimate gun ownership in all 50 states and looked for a relationship with suicide. The researchers controlled for other factors such as poverty, urbanization, unemployment, drug and alcohol abuse, and mental illness. More Lethal Suicide attempts with firearms are much more likely to be fatal than other means, according to the study. Though lethal self-inflicted gunshot wounds make up just 5 percent of all suicide attempts, more than 90 percent of such cases are fatal, the researchers said. That compares with a fatality rate of less than 3 percent for drug-related suicides, which constitute about 75 percent of all attempts. More than half of the 32,439 Americans who committed suicide in 2004 used a gun, according to the study. Suicides by other means weren't significantly associated with rates of gun ownership, the research showed. The study didn't address whether some people buy guns with the specific intent to commit suicide. Researchers recommended that guns either be removed from the home or stored securely and separately from ammunition. "Removing firearms may be especially effective in reducing the risk of suicide among adolescents and other potentially impulsive members of the home," Miller said in the statement. The research was sponsored by the Chicago-based Joyce Foundation, which supports programs in the region on topics including the environment, education and public welfare. The foundation's projects have included research on preventing violence with firearms. The six states in the study with the lowest rates of gun ownership were Hawai'i, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, New Jersey, Connecticut and New York. The 15 states with the highest percentage of homes with guns were Wyoming, South Dakota, Alaska, West Virginia, Arkansas, Montana, Mississippi, Idaho, North Dakota, Alabama, Kentucky, Wisconsin, Louisiana, Tennessee and Utah. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 10:30:23 -0500 From: Joe Gingrich Subject: Get Involved, Help Win the Case Get Involved, Help Win the Case http://www.brucemontague.ca/html/0006.html#donate Scrapping Bill C-68 is a massive legal and public relations battle so everyone's contribution, whether time, money, or expertise, is critical to success. Volunteer» Donate» Advertise» Write» Volunteer Would you be able to help setup a local meeting for Bruce's next Fundraising Tour? Are you media savvy or do you have marketing experience? This is your chance to help make some meaningful changes to the firearms laws in this country. If you are able to help with fund-raising, public relations, advertising, or other areas please email Bruce. Donate to the Scrap C-68 Legal Fund Let's do our part to raise funds in our clubs, associations and businesses. Ask for generous donations. a.. Donations of $100 and above will receive a copy of the documentary "Good Men vs. Bad Law". b.. Donations of $250 and above will receive a copy of the documentary "Good Men vs. Bad Law" and the Saskatoon Firearms Act Seminar 4-DVD set. c.. Donations of $500 and above will receive copies of the Saskatoon Seminar and the documentaries "Good Men vs. Bad Law", "Illegal Acts" and "Shootout at Rock Creek". Please send your cheque payable to the "Bruce Montague Scrap C-68 Fund" c/o Roger Nordlund, Trustee, RR#2, Site 211, Box 7, Dryden, Ontario, P8N 2Y5 Electronic transfer or direct deposit Dryden TD Canada Trust: 30 Princess St. Dryden, ON, Canada P8N 1C6 Transit #6068 Account #5201970 ABA #026009593 Make a Secure Online Donation using your credit card. Supports VISA, MasterCard, American Express, etc. Read Bruce's Thank-you Letter to Supporters. Note from Bruce: Please do me a favour and let me know if you use the electronic method of donation so that I can keep a list of supporters. I would like to thank each of you personally. Contact Bruce by Email Form Advertise the C-68 Court Challenge Download, print, display and distribute the Fundraising Flyer: One Page Version (35K) or Two Page Version (195K) (Acrobat PDF). Promote the cause among your contacts. Email the home page to your contacts (in IE use Tools/Mail&News/SendPage). Write Do you know Bruce personally? Write a character reference for our Testimonials section. Do you have an opinion? Write a letter to the editor and send it to the papers. Email your articles, letters and testimonials using the Email Form. - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- back to top | search | home | site map DISCLAIMER: BruceMontague.ca is maintained by friends and supporters of Bruce Montague. It is NOT an official mouth-piece for Bruce Montague's legal defense. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 09:50:14 -0700 From: Len Miller Subject: What gun control didn't do for Canada Posted on Mon, Apr. 09, 2007 What a handgun ban didn't do for D.C. Is there a "smoking gun" that proves the efficacy of gun laws? Or are such claims based on illusion? By Steve Goldstein Inquirer Washington Bureau WASHINGTON - Shortly before 3 a.m. last Monday, 41-year-old Vincent White of Temple Hills, Md., was shot multiple times and killed on a street in the southeast section of Washington. It was the District of Columbia's 40th homicide of the year. "If people are allowed to buy guns and have them in their houses in D.C.," Graves said, "there will be more killings and more deaths of people that look like me, and there will be more mothers crying who look like mine." - ------------------------------- Notice how the ''post hoc'' misleading line has been played. Reporter Goldstein, exposes the hoax of gun control. Guns, in the home, protect . . Guns 'on the street' don't . . . Law-abiding guns in 'in the home' are NOT 'on the street' . . Which is not what the Liberals have done. They lied. C-68 has cost lives, not 'saved' any . . . Congratulations to the CPC for the honest attempt to deal with the cruel hoax of C-68 . . ( a pity we had to hear it from the media . .) I am sure there would be lives saved, ( e.g. Bob and Bonnie Dagenais , Ragnar Michaelson, Bill Rose) . . . were citizens permitted/allowed the opportunity to protect themselves. After all THEY know when they are in trouble . . not a judge . certainly not a reporter . . (post facto) if you are reading about it, it's too late . . Len Miller Vancouver See Senator Ray Haynes' . . 'Dangerous Laws' Orange county Register . ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 13:28:18 -0400 From: "mred" Subject: Re: [US] Hawai'i part of study linking suicide, gun ownership - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bruce Mills" To: Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2007 12:10 PM Subject: [US] Hawai'i part of study linking suicide, gun ownership > http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2007/Apr/10/br/br7135986204.html > > Hawai'i part of study linking suicide, gun ownership > > Researchers recommended that guns either be removed > from the home or stored securely and separately from > ammunition. > > "Removing firearms may be especially effective in > reducing the risk of suicide among adolescents and > other potentially impulsive members of the home," > Miller said in the statement. > > The research was sponsored by the Chicago-based Joyce > Foundation, which supports programs in the region on > topics including the environment, education and public > welfare. The foundation's projects have included > research on preventing violence with firearms. > > The six states in the study with the lowest rates of > gun ownership were Hawai'i, Massachusetts, Rhode > Island, New Jersey, Connecticut and New York. > > The 15 states with the highest percentage of homes > with guns were Wyoming, South Dakota, Alaska, West > Virginia, Arkansas, Montana, Mississippi, Idaho, North > Dakota, Alabama, Kentucky, Wisconsin, Louisiana, > Tennessee and Utah. Remove drugs as well if they cause 75% of the suicides? ed/ontario ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 01:41:45 -0500 From: "bletchley park" Subject: Re: "Holocaust deniers" - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Todd Birch" To: Sent: Monday, April 09, 2007 11:14 AM Subject: "Holocaust deniers" > I kind of like the sun spot/Mars fart theory myself. Takes away any > responsibility for human contribution and leaves me feeling less guilty when > I pack home the grub in half a dozen disposable plastic bags. > > TB Todd: I and several members of this august forum have been deeply concerned, as of late, about your strange opinions regarding 'Glo-bull Warming' and it's possible exacerbation by human activity. All that we can say is, thank God you've seen the light. A guilty mind is a terrible waste. Welcome back. :-) Best Regards, Peter ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 11:50:31 -0500 From: Joe Gingrich Subject: The Bill of Rights Test ALERT FROM JEWS FOR THE PRESERVATION OF FIREARMS OWNERSHIP America's Aggressive Civil Rights Organization April 11, 2007 JPFO ALERT: The Bill of Rights Test "Chief Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes was wrong. You have an absolute and perfect right to shout 'Fire!' in a crowded theater -- and to accept responsibility for the consequences." (Alexander Hope in Hope) The defining charactistic of Alexander Hope in the novel _Hope_ ( http://shop.jpfo.org/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=20 ) is his absolute commitment to upholding the Bill of Rights. The Bill of Rights is a list of absolute do-not-cross-this- line rules for the federal government, and it differentiates America from every other country in the world. Our latest Concealed Carry Magazine column explains how a "Bill of Rights" test, or BORT, can protect not just gun owners' rights, but the rights of all Americans. Simply put, for any government law, program, or policy, just ask the question: "Does this violate the Bill of Rights?" Any law or policy that violates any element of the Bill of Rights must be rejected. If a candidate stands for ideas that would violate the Bill of Rights, that candidate is no friend of freedom. The BORT is not a liberal or conservative approach. It is a distinctly American approach that can bear fruit for gun owners and all citizens. Go to www.jpfo.org/ccm200704.pdf to read more about it. - The Liberty Crew ============================================================ JPFO mirror site: http://www.jpfo.net ============================================================ LET JPFO KEEP YOU INFORMED -- Sign up today for JPFO Alerts! Just send a blank e-mail to jpfoalerts-subscribe@jpfo.org. To unsubscribe, send a blank email to jpfoalerts-unsubscribe@jpfo.org ============================================================= Regain your freedom - download the song "Justice Day" today! http://www.rebelfirerock.com/downloadjd.html ============================================================= Original Material in JPFO ALERTS is Copyright 2006 JPFO, Inc. Permission is granted to reproduce this alert in full, so long as the following JPFO contact information is included: Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership PO Box 270143 Hartford, Wisconsin 53027 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 14:10:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Bruce Mills Subject: [BLOG] Guns, Fraud, and Big Numbers in Canada http://sagaciousiconoclast.blogspot.com/2004/02/guns-fraud-and-big-numbers-in-canada.html Guns, Fraud, and Big Numbers in Canada [The following essay won the Letter of the Week award on 2004-02-24 at Mark Steyn's web site, http://www.marksteyn.com In honour thereof, Mr.Steyn graciously sent me a copy of his "The Face of the Tiger", autographed: "Congratulations. A Great Letter." ] My Fellow Canadian ~ I once read an excellent Isaac Asimov non-fiction essay on really big numbers. Humans are in general really bad at understanding big numbers. Because of my math / science / engineering background, I'm maybe a bit better than average, but I'm no Asimov. I have though learned a few ways to help me better understand big numbers, so that I can better deal with them when I need to. This essay shows how some of those methods work. The initial Government of Canada estimate for the gun registry database system was $1 million. Technically, I think that's probably a bit low. Based on my on three decades of work in the field of distributed multi-user database transaction processing systems like the registry, and on some systems I'm currently working on which are of that type, I think $3 million would have been a better estimate. If someone from the Government of Canada can provide me with a simple accounting showing some component of the system that I've missed, I'd be more than happy to adjust my analysis of the situation to take that data into account. My current analysis is based on the numbers I have collected from the public media over the last few years. Given how important it is for state monopolies to serve citizens to the highest possible ethical standard, let's throw in a factor of three-ish over my base estimate and call it $10 million, to be as careful as possible. Now, say you had such a $10 million contract with some customers. And then, say you spent three times that: $30 million. Does it occur to you that your customers (in this case, we citizens) might be, oh, shall we say, somewhat angry? Ok, let's say it's another factor of three: $90 million. How are your customers doing now? Fine. Let's throw in another factor of three, so we're now up to $270 million. How angry are your customers now? In more primitive times than we live in, would you still be alive? But wait, there's more. How much would we pay for another factor of three? Oh, about $810 million. Say, that's interesting, the gun registry database system has, according to the CBC, cost $750 million. It didn't cost 3 times as much. Or 3 times 3 times as much. Or 3 times 3 times 3 times as much. It cost 3 times 3 times 3 times 3 times as much. That's like planning to have two children, and ending up with 162 (two times three to the power of four). Now stop. Think about that number, 162 children. It's unimaginable that you could legitimately have 162 children, in any way whatsoever. Likewise, there is no way I can come up with to imagine how the registry database project could legitimately cost $750 million, whatsoever. Never mind that it is to me unfathomable that it could take eight years to develop the registry database, and never mind that according to the CBC it doesn't actually work; $750 million divided by eight years is about $250,000 per day. That's right, they spent what should have been, at its most extreme, a $10 million budget for the entire project, they spent that much every 40 days, for eight years. Here's another way to look at it. The database system has cost about 750 / 8 = $94 million per year, for eight years. Loaded full-time staff costs in this field are about $100,000 per year. That means the development of this system employed 940 full-time staff per year for eight years. How the hell can a database fundamentally designed to store and retrieve 7 million gun records distributed across 3 million person records take 7,500 man-years to develop? What is this, the Pyramid of Cheops? (Actually, the CBC's total cost figure of $2 billion for the entire gun registry "file" amounts to about $685,000 per day, which means they spent the entire initially estimated budget of $2 million, again according to the CBC, every three days, for eight years straight. That's 20,000 man-years, to register 7 million guns. But what do I know, I'm just a software guy, I'll stick to the database system.) Corporations get sued for cost overruns on the order of tens of percent. Assuming my careful $10 million estimate is reasonable, the registry database is not 10 % over. It's not 100 % over. It's not 1,000 % over. It's 7,500 % over. It's not 10 times less than the standard we citizens are held to, under threat of criminal prosecution. It's not 100 times less. The state's standard of performance for itself is 750 times less than the standard it holds us to. Who the hell, exactly, do these people think they are, and why the hell shouldn't we smite them? Ok, I'll tell you what. Section 380 of the Criminal Code of Canada calls for jail for up to 10 years for fraud over $5,000. Applying the 750 factor apparently used by State Canada, let's just say that any politician or civil servant that is guilty of fraud over $5,000 should go to jail for 7,500 years. That's starting to sound like a big enough number for me. Posted by Vitruvius at 2/24/2004 01:01:00 PM ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 15:54:21 -0400 From: News@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Subject: News Release: Proposal for firearms amnesty PUBLIC SAFETY CANADA NEWS RELEASE http://www.publicsafety.gc.ca/media/nr/2007/nr20070411-en.asp Proposal for firearms amnesty OTTAWA, April 11, 2007 - The Honourable Stockwell Day, Minister of Public Safety, today announced that the Government of Canada is seeking comments on a proposal to extend the firearms amnesty for one more year. An Amending Order, pursuant to Subsection 117.14(1) of the Criminal Code was pre-published in the Canada Gazette Saturday April 7, 2007. The public can comment on the proposed amnesty until April 21, 2007. If approved, the extension would be in effect until May 16, 2008 and would provide an additional period for non-restricted firearm owners to become compliant with licensing and registration requirements. The current amnesty expires on May 16, 2007. The Firearms Act, which has been in place since 1995, and the Criminal Code require that all firearms owners be licensed and all firearms be registered. According to the current law, in order to legally retain firearms, owners must hold both a valid licence and a registration certificate for those firearms. An online version of the Canada Gazette is available at: http://canadagazette.gc.ca/partI/2007/20070407/html/regle3-e.html Information: Media Relations Public Safety Canada 613-991-0657 Lisa Leclerc Director of Communications Office of the Honourable Stockwell Day Minister of Public Safety 613-991-2863 ------------------------------ End of Cdn-Firearms Digest V10 #391 *********************************** Submissions: mailto:cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Mailing List Commands: mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Moderator's e-mail address: mailto:akimoya@cogeco.ca List owner: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca FAQ list: http://www.magma.ca/~asd/cfd-faq1.html and http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/Faq/cfd-faq1.html Web Site: http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/homepage.html FTP Site: ftp://teapot.usask.ca/pub/cdn-firearms/ CFDigest Archives: http://www.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca/~ab133/ or put the next command in an e-mail message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca get cdn-firearms-digest v04.n192 end (192 is the digest issue number and 04 is the volume) To unsubscribe from _all_ the lists, put the next five lines in a message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca unsubscribe cdn-firearms-digest unsubscribe cdn-firearms-alert unsubscribe cdn-firearms-chat unsubscribe cdn-firearms end (To subscribe, use "subscribe" instead of "unsubscribe".) 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