From: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca (Cdn-Firearms Digest) To: cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Subject: Cdn-Firearms Digest V15 #460 Reply-To: cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Sender: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Errors-To: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Precedence: normal owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Cdn-Firearms Digest Tuesday, January 8 2013 Volume 15 : Number 460 In this issue: [none] [none] [none] [none] [none] [none] [none] [none] [none] [none] [none] [none] [none] [none] [none] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: From: Subject: [none] Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 15:11:04 -0500 (EST) From: Rob Sciuk Subject: letter to Globe (just sent) Not arbitrary to be tough on guns ... (fwd) Dear Sir/Madame, Simple posession of a firearm is a crime in Canada only since 1995, when the Liberal's felt the need to implement a Federal licensing scheme. To wrestle the right to license away from the provinces, the Liberals made simple posession of a firearm a federal crime so that they could bring it under federal jurisdiction. Prior to 1995, Canadian's were required to have an firearms acquistion certificate (FAC) to come into posession of a firearm, but firearm ownership was never considered a crime, nor should it be now. Indeed, the FAC system had all the same vetting and training requirements now tied to licensing, as well as the parental or spousal permission requirements, and an effective revocation mechanism. Indeed ALL of the public safety benefits attributed to licensing were already in place long before the Canadian Firearms Act came into being. So, given that every law abiding firearm owner in Canada has been literally made into a criminal with the flourish of a pen, how has this expensive controversial and politically charged law benefitted anyone? Sincerely, Robert S. Sciuk ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 15:19:20 -0600 From: "Joe Gingrich" Subject: regarding: Time to abolish Indian Act letter sent to StarPhoenix, unpublished http://www.thestarphoenix.com/news/Time+abolish+Indian+racist+relic/7782749/story.html I read the article, 'Time to abolish Indian Act, a racist relic', by Michael Den Tandt, The StarPhoenix, Jan. 7, 2013 In it Mr. Den Tandt opines that "neither individuals nor the bands themselves hold title to their lands or homes on Canada's Indian reserves." He continued, the "lack of property rights is not incidental. It is fundamental. It prevents the securing of mortgages, the building of equity and the accumulation of wealth." But he overlooks a deeper problem existing all across Canada. No one has individual property rights protection from state deprivation of our privately held property. It's because the right was never included within Trudeau's 1982 "Charter of rights and freedoms". Look it up. The right to own property is one of our oldest, most fundamental and powerful rights in British-Canadian legal history. The right can be traced back to the Magna Carta (1215), the 1688 English Bill of Rights, John Locke's Second Treatise (1690), Sir William Blackstone's Commentaries on the Laws of England (1765-1769) and the Canadian Bill of Rights (1960). This suppression of our individual right to own property, by the govt. of the day, is what makes federal and provincial proceeds of crime acts, along with many other unjust laws, so dangerous to our civil right to own property.(1,2,3,4) Although the Charter is currently used to screen this right from us and thus allows rights infringing laws to be leveled against us by the state; the Charter's section 26 can be employed to re-introduce our still vital civil rights, including our individual right to own property.(5,7) You see, civil rights never expire, never cease to exist, and can never be exitinguished.(6) We need our rights, now! Yours in Tyranny, Joe Gingrich White Fox sources: 1. The Seizure of Criminal Property Act, (2009), http://www.justice.gov.sk.ca/Seizure-of-Criminal-Property-Act-2009 2. Federal, Forfeiture of Proceeds of Crime Criminal Code, R.S.C. 1985, c. C-46 s. 462.37 3. .Mr.s Harper and Chretien's "Bill C-68", "Statutes of Canada 1995Chapter 39, an Act respecting firearms and other weapons", 4. Liberals, Anti-terrorism Act (2001) http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2011/09/06/stephen-harper_n_951367.html 5. Charter of rights and freedoms, section 26. The guarantee in this Charter of certain rights and freedoms shall not be construed as denying the existence of any other rights or freedoms that exist in Canada. 6. Sparrow, 1990, Supreme Court of Canada 7. R v. Smith (Edward Dewey), [1987], Supreme Court of Canada, civil rights (property) from held in preamble of Canadian Constitution Acts of 1982 ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 17:04:17 -0500 From: Mark L Horstead Subject: RE: Will assault rifle ban end gun violence? > -----Original Message----- > From: jyoung@aernet.ca > Sent: 6-Jan-13 4:46 PM > Subject: Re: Will assault rifle ban end gun violence? > In reality, less than 1/4 of 1% of all > gun murders were caused by this particular rifle. In real reality, not a single murder has *ever* been caused by this particular rifle. Or any other firearm. Mark ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] Subject: Ventura video Sender: Al Muir Date: Jan 7/13 After watching this I tryed to retrieve it without the link only to discover it was cut and re-edited in the enclosed version. Not sure what the real audience reception was. Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2013 15:53:30 -0800 From: j davies Subject: Jesse Ventura disassembles Piers Morgan on "gun control" Jesse Ventura disassembles Piers Morgan on "gun control" video: http://www.americanthinker.com/video/2012/12/jesse_ventura_crushes_piers_morgan_on_2nd_amendment.html ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] I was just censored by Facebook! This was the comment I tried to post..this was the addy; http://www.facebook.com/sunnewsnetwork/posts/108686105974177?comment_id423¬if_tshare_reply . Billie Jones Harper is a criminal Like . Reply . 41 minutes ago 1 Reply * http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc6/203226_100000440968547_2919745_q.jpg Todd Brown This had nothing to do with Harper and EVERYTHING to do with the Firearms Act(bill C-68) forced on us by the Liberals. The FA is what needs to go. Unable to post comment. Know your rights, or you won't have any Todd Brown Concerned Gun Owners of Alberta Co-founder CGOA bvhunting@xplornet.com ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 21:27:42 -0700 From: "Todd Brown" Subject: RE: scrapped data You hit the nail on the head, Todd! Well done! Know your rights, or you won't have any Todd Brown Concerned Gun Owners of Alberta Co-founder CGOA bvhunting@xplornet.com -----Original Message----- Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 09:33:54 -0800 From: Todd Birch Subject: re: scrapped data Why does it matter if the data bank has been destroyed in it's entirety? I'll say it again ..... Because we were told it WAS destroyed. If copies do exist elsewhere in cyberland, then we have been lied to on a monumental scale - again. Does that matter if there is ever going to be a round up of any particular type of firearm or firearms in general? No. Does it matter if the data bank is degraded or out of date? No. Does it matter if your guns are rounded up if you let your licence expire? Yes. Some still haven't got it, despite Len's constant hammering away at it "LICENCING IS THE PROBLEM! No wonder Len gets so crotchety at times ..... If you let your vehicle licence expire, your vehicles are not confiscated and they are still registered. People let their licences and passports expire all the time due to illnesses and just plain oversight due to busy lives. If you're someone who tends to remember birth dates and anniversaries, or have a secretary to keep you organized, good for you. If there is any way this can be made clearer to those who have difficulty grasping this reality, please, let us know, and give yourself the Gibbs slap upside the head when it finally dawns on you. ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 20:35:03 -0800 From: j davies Subject: well, duh... On 07/01/2013 8:01 PM, Cdn-Firearms Digest wrote: > CBC - Attawapiskat audit finds 'no evidence of due diligence' > Spokesman for Chief Theresa Spence says leak meant to discredit her well, duh... There is a lesson here for us. Note how often the left uses an obvious fact like Chief Still-Fat-as-the-Michelin-Man's multi-faceted and irrefutable skills at thievery as an attack. And, when the LSM runs with it people act like it actually makes sense. here is the recipe for the Chief's "moose soup" 4 lbs filet mignon [rich people don't eat moose] 14 Potatoes 2 Onions 24 Oz. Mayonnaise 1 magnum red wine 6 Old Style Don't cook it, that's for her minions to do. ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 07:21:10 -0500 From: tliner Subject: Re: Search warrants await holders of guns with expired ... i wont even dignify that reply with an answer. must be something to be perfect -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Search warrants await holders of guns with expired ... From: jyoung@aernet.ca Date: Mon, January 7, 2013 8:37 am Re: Search warrants await holders of guns with expired ... Yes, that's right. You're absolutely correct. It's called taking full responsibility for our own affairs, relying less on the State, and being fully accountable for our own actions - and inactions. I know, it is a concept foreign to many. :-) -----Original Message----- Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 03:38:00 -0500 From: tliner Subject: Re: Search warrants await holders of guns with expired ... ...licenses so the same goes for drivers licence and licence plate notices too? insurance renewal ? property taxes? maybe we should drop all renewal notices for everything. forget and you are probably not fit to have a car, a home or posessions Bill -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Search warrants await holders of guns with expired licenses From: jyoung@aernet.ca Date: Sun, January 6, 2013 9:42 pm Re: Search warrants await holders of guns with expired licenses I agree with what you're saying about becoming a criminal for failure to renew...but, at the end of the proverbial day, if we cannot assume full and complete responsibility for renewing our licenses on time, without suitable and frequent reminders from the Nanny State, then I question our fitness to own and use arms. Time to let go of the rope. -----Original Message----- From: decline@pteradon.tera-byte.com Date: Sun, January 6, 2013 11:56 Subject: Re: Search warrants await holders of guns with expired licenses We are only a heartbeat away from the same fate as the Phillipines. It is the LICENSE that makes normal people into victimless "paper" criminals. You can GO TO JAIL for "forgetfulness" and that does not neccessarily mean "your own." If the CFC "forgets" to send you a renewal, you are toast. They happened to "forget" to send renewals to some 400 seniors in Toronto and those were raided and their guns confiscated under threat of jail. These honest people had owned their firearms all their lives. That is the obscenity of C-68 Firearms Act which was promised repeal by OUR Conservative government. Don Klein Member Conservative Party of Canada BCC members, legal, and other concerned parties. > Philippines: Search warrants await holders of guns with expired licenses > By Teresa Ellera - Sunday, January 6, 2013 > http://www.sunstar.com.ph/bacolod/local-news/2013/01/06/search-warrants-await-holders-guns-expired-licenses-261659 > > POLICE Regional Office Director Agrimero Cruz warned holders of guns with > expired licenses that search warrants will be out soon against them. Cruz > said they have been calling to those firearm holders with expired licenses > to renew their licenses as he emphasized the police campaign against loose > firearms. To date, Task Force "Armas" has recorded a total of 33,067 loose > firearms as of August 30, 2012, and PRO-Western Visayas has already > visited > 11,061 owners of formerly registered firearms. The task force is headed by > Police Senior Superintendent Wesley Barayuga, deputy regional director of > PRO Western Visayas. Cruz said 2,247 gun holders have renewed their gun > licenses while 3,807 signified their intention to renew following the > creation of the task force. ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 07:57:44 -0500 From: JULES SOBRIAN Subject: Gaping hole in the Sandy Hook massacre > THE GIANT, GAPING HOLE IN SANDY HOOK REPORTING > Exclusive: David Kupelian says 1 piece of crucial information has yet > to be disclosed. > > But where, I'd like to ask my colleagues in the media, is the reporting > about the psychiatric medications the perpetrator - who had been under > treatment for mental-health problems - may have been taking? > > I see this whole dissertation on the effect of psychiatric drugs and > association with multiple murders as a red herring. All of the > perpetrators who were or were not on anti-psychotic drugs already had > the mass murder potential before ever becoming exposed to the > medication. It might be that the medication is not as effective at > curtailing the symptoms as big pharma and a gullible medical > profession would have you believe, but that in no way places > responsibility for the evil intent on the pills or those who > manufactured them. The real gaping hole is the fact that the rifle used to kill all twenty six victims was found in the 'perpetrator's' car, not in the school. The only firearms found in the school with the dead body of the so-called perpetrator were four handguns. It is impossible that a dead perp could have taken the rifle out to the car and returned into the school to lie down with his handguns. One of the teachers said she saw two 'shadows' flit by her door, which was treated only cursorily by the press. Another party was arrested and released from the woods beside the school. He denied having anything to do with the shooting when he was stopped and was therefore released, unidentified. To any sensible observer, this could only mean one of two things: the Bushmaster rifle had wings and a vital force of its own to fly out of the school after the so-called perp was killed, or that the real shooter shot the so-called perp with a handgun, dropped the handgun beside the body and ran out with the rifle. When he got outside and realized his mistake, he jettisoned the rifle in the 'perp's' car to maintain its association with the 'perp' and then headed for the woods. I select the second. How about you? This is another 9/11. This time the purpose is to create public consternation against semi-automatic rifles and grease the wheels of legislative action against them. Jules ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2013 07:09:24 -0700 From: 10x@telus.net Subject: Re: letter to Globe (just sent) At 03:11 PM 07/01/2013 -0500, you wrote: > >Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 15:11:04 -0500 (EST) >From: Rob Sciuk >Subject: letter to Globe (just sent) > >Not arbitrary to be tough on guns ... (fwd) > >Dear Sir/Madame, > >Simple posession of a firearm is a crime in Canada only since 1995, when >the Liberal's felt the need to implement a Federal licensing scheme. To >wrestle the right to license away from the provinces, the Liberals made >simple posession of a firearm a federal crime so that they could bring it >under federal jurisdiction. > >Prior to 1995, Canadian's were required to have an firearms acquistion >certificate (FAC) to come into posession of a firearm, but firearm >ownership was never considered a crime, nor should it be now. Indeed, the >FAC system had all the same vetting and training requirements now tied to >licensing, as well as the parental or spousal permission requirements, and >an effective revocation mechanism. Indeed ALL of the public safety >benefits attributed to licensing were already in place long before the >Canadian Firearms Act came into being. > >So, given that every law abiding firearm owner in Canada has been >literally made into a criminal with the flourish of a pen, how has this >expensive controversial and politically charged law benefitted anyone? > >Sincerely, >Robert S. Sciuk Research on crime rate and gun laws done in Canada by C. Langmann indicate that all of those "public safety benefits attributed to licensing" of gun owner have not had any effect on either public safety or a reduction in crime rate with firearms. Mr. Langmanns research covered 1974 to 2008 and used reliable data from the Govenrment of Canada. There were over 25 variables accounted for. Peer review allowed Dr. Langmann to address and clarify parts of the study and research that seemed to be weak. Three different methods were used to analyze the data and any one who uses the data and any of those three methods comes out agreeing with Dr. Langmanns conclusions. The point arises, if one almost bullet proof study indicates that no gun laws have made any difference, then maybe we should consider all of the gun laws a waste of tax dollars and look to other methods to limit crime in Canada. Those bent on committing crimes use what ever tool is at hand - reducing or removing access to firearms does not change their morals, or will to trample the rights of others. If something does not work and there is evidence it does not work, why not tell the truth? Apparently there are folks in the Federal civil service and in Politics who are not telling the public the truth about guns and gun owners. Promoting licensing as a solution to reducing crime and violence is not telling the truth either. ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 08:07:53 -0600 From: "Joe Gingrich" Subject: Bank of America Freezes Gun Manufacturer's Account, Company ... ...Owner Claims http://cnsnews.com/blog/gregory-gwyn-williams-jr/bank-america-freezes-gun-manufacturers-account-company-owner-claims Bank of America Freezes Gun Manufacturer's Account, Company Owner Claims By Gregory Gwyn-Williams, Jr. January 7, 2013 Bank of America has reportedly frozen the account of gun manufacturer American Spirit Arms, according to its owner, Joe Sirochman. In a Facebook post dated December 29, Sirochman wrote the following: "My name is Joe Sirochman owner of American Spirit Arms...our Web site orders have jumped 500 percent causing our Web site e-commerce processing larger deposits to Bank of America. So they decided to hold the deposits for further review. "After countless hours on the phone with Bank of America, I finally got a manager in the right department that told me the reason that the deposits were on hold for further review -- her exact words were -- 'We believe you should not be selling guns and parts on the Internet.'"(emphasis added) Sirochman also wrote that he told the bank manager that "they have no right to make up their own new rules and regs" and that "[American Spirit is a] firearms manufacturer with all the proper licensing." He also noted that he has been doing business with Bank of America for over 10 years, but will now be looking for a new bank. According to Unlawful News, this isn't the first time Bank of America has targeted a customer involved in the firearms industry. McMillan Group International was reportedly told that its business was no longer welcome after the company started manufacturing firearms - even after 12 years of doing business with the bank. CNSNews.com is not funded by the government like NPR. ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] At 03:19 PM 07/01/2013 -0600, you wrote: > >Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 15:19:20 -0600 >From: "Joe Gingrich" >Subject: regarding: Time to abolish Indian Act > > >letter sent to StarPhoenix, unpublished > >http://www.thestarphoenix.com/news/Time+abolish+Indian+racist+relic/7782749/story.html > >I read the article, 'Time to abolish Indian Act, a racist relic', by Michael >Den Tandt, The StarPhoenix, Jan. 7, 2013 > >In it Mr. Den Tandt opines that "neither individuals nor the bands >themselves hold title to their lands or homes on Canada's Indian reserves." >He continued, the "lack of property rights is not incidental. It is >fundamental. It prevents the securing of mortgages, the building of equity >and the accumulation of wealth." But he overlooks a deeper problem existing >all across Canada. No one has individual property rights protection from >state deprivation of our privately held property. It's because the right >was never included within Trudeau's 1982 "Charter of rights and freedoms". >Look it up. The right to own property is one of our oldest, most >fundamental and powerful rights in British-Canadian legal history. The >right can be traced back to the Magna Carta (1215), the 1688 English Bill of >Rights, John Locke's Second Treatise (1690), Sir William Blackstone's >Commentaries on the Laws of England (1765-1769) and the Canadian Bill of >Rights (1960). This suppression of our individual right to own property, by >the govt. of the day, is what makes federal and provincial proceeds of crime >acts, along with many other unjust laws, so dangerous to our civil right to >own property.(1,2,3,4) Although the Charter is currently used to screen >this right from us and thus allows rights infringing laws to be leveled >against us by the state; the Charter's section 26 can be employed to >re-introduce our still vital civil rights, including our individual right to >own property.(5,7) You see, civil rights never expire, never cease to >exist, and can never be exitinguished.(6) We need our rights, now! It is of note that the South African Government used the Canadian "Indian Act" as a model to create their "townships" as part of the apartheid program there. ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] From: Mikeack Date: 20130108 Re: Impending confiscations On 2013-01-08 00:01, Cdn-Firearms Digest wrote: > Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 03:42:27 -0500 > From: tliner > Subject: Re: Scrapped data? > > > and if they ever come for specific guns they will have a hard time > explaining where they obtained that info. They won't explain it, they'll just take your stuff and you will be left with the choice of eating their sh!t vs bankrupting your family pursuing an endlessly convoluted legal process to no avail. The law is never an obstacle to tyrants. -- M.J. Ackermann, MD (Mike) Rural Family Physician, Sherbrooke, NS mikeack@ns.sympatico.ca "Hope for the best, but be prepared for the worst". ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] Subject: [Fwd: A message from the author of "Enemies Foreign and Domestic"] From: decline@pteradon.tera-byte.com Date: Tue, January 8, 2013 10:12 am Mighty powerful... D ---------------------------- Original Message ---------------------------- Subject: A message from the author of "Enemies Foreign and Domestic" -------------------------------------------------------------------------- You who have read the book will understand. Even those who haven't. But there is NO DOUBT the Obama Administration and the corrupt UN mean to eliminate the 2nd amendment from the US constitution and confiscate all guns. We all know what happens when citizens are disarmed. Russia, (30 million killed by government) Germany, (tens of millions die with no chance of defense) China (50-70 million killed by government thugs) and so on the carnage goes. The USA ALONE has a constitution to prevent government killing, but with programs like Obama/Holder "Fast and Furious" the killing is already happening.... http://westernrifleshooters.wordpress.com/2013/01/07/bracken-dear-mr-security-agent/ this is a MUST read. ------------------------------ Date: From: Subject: [none] Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 09:33:54 -0800 From: "Joe Gingrich" Subject: re: scrapped data > Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 09:33:54 -0800 > From: Todd Birch > Subject: re: scrapped data > > Some still haven't got it, despite Len's constant > hammering away at it "LICENCING IS THE PROBLEM! No wonder Len > gets so crotchety at times ..... > > If you let your vehicle licence expire, your vehicles are not > confiscated and they are still registered. People let their licences and > passports expire all the time due to illnesses and just plain oversight > due to busy lives. If you're someone who tends to remember > birth dates and anniversaries, or have a secretary to keep you organized, > good for you. At the Montreal Convention, Workshop D - (Security At Home and Abroad), in 2005, Vic Toews was concerned (he said he was anyway), as were we, about the govt. tracking innocent Canadians through the firearm licensing scheme. The firearms license expires so the govt. can keep track of the individual with updated information provided by the licensee's renewal application. The licenses initially, I think, had a 90% error rate (wrong information, wrong address, wrong photo ect.). Today firearms licenses have been corrected through expiration and renewal and are probably fairly accurate. Most gun owners and their dog knew the firearms registration scheme was garbage and even more error filled. The police assoc., ant-gun activitists, most lefty politicans knew this also, but pretended that they didn't. The easiest way to repair this was to purge the system because this registry didn't expire, as mentioned. This, Mr. Harper, says he has done. However, Mr. Harper's govt. erroneously states that destroying the data will prevent another 'long-gun registry' from being "revised". A majority government can reinstate the long-gun registry scheme and it would likely be fairly accurate. Even if the Cons. were to repeal Bill C-68, as they promised, it could be easily revised by a majority govt. Unless "the rights of law-abiding Canadians to own and use firearms" are respected by the govt. of Canada, what will be purged is the Cdn. firearms community The Conservative Party Policy - March 2005 Firearms Policy A Conservative Government will repeal Canada's costly gun registry legislation and work with the provinces and territories on cost-effective gun control programs designed to keep guns out of the hands of criminals while respecting the rights of law-abiding Canadians to own and use firearms responsibly. Measures will include: mandatory minimum sentences for the criminal use of firearms; strict monitoring of high-risk individuals; crackdown on the smuggling; safe storage provisions; firearms safety training; a certification screening system for all those wishing to acquire firearms legally; and putting more law enforcement officers on our streets. Yours in Tyranny, Joe Gingrich White Fox ------------------------------ End of Cdn-Firearms Digest V15 #460 *********************************** Submissions: mailto:cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Mailing List Commands: mailto:majordomo@scorpion.bogend.ca Moderator email: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@scorpion.bogend.ca List owner: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@scorpion.bogend.ca FAQ list: http://www.canfirearms/Skeeter/Faq/cfd-faq1.html Web Site: http://www.canfirearms.ca CFDigest Archives: http://www.canfirearms.ca/archives To unsubscribe from _all_ the lists, put the next four lines in a message and mailto:majordomo@scorpion.bogend.ca unsubscribe cdn-firearms-digest unsubscribe cdn-firearms-chat unsubscribe cdn-firearms end (To subscribe, use "subscribe" instead of "unsubscribe".)