From: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca (Cdn-Firearms Digest) To: cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Subject: Cdn-Firearms Digest V15 #580 Reply-To: cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Sender: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Errors-To: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Precedence: normal owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Cdn-Firearms Digest Wednesday, February 27 2013 Volume 15 : Number 580 In this issue: Ron Paul wants their guns WA Gun Bill: Follow-up Fw: Gotta love this Wyoming state rep! Virtual State of the Union 2013 - Guns Calgary Women's Emergency Shelter forced to turn away 3,000 ... Fw: Watch your mail : ABC broadcast edits out Michelle Obama claim Nuclear waste meetings held in Sask *NFR* NATIONAL REVIEW: Against Gun Registration Tenth U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals Rules There Is No Right ... CBC - Alleged pistol-whipping leads to B.C. weapons cache Obama urged to back tough arms trade treaty at U.N. talks ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2013 15:49:27 -0800 From: "Clive Edwards" <45clive@telus.net> Subject: Ron Paul wants their guns While I oppose most gun control proposals, there is one group of Americans I do believe should be disarmed: federal agents. The use of force by federal agents to enforce unjust and unconstitutional laws is one of the major, albeit overlooked, threats to liberty. Too often Americans are victimized by government force simply for engaging in commercial transactions disapproved of by Congress and the federal bureaucracy. http://www.thedailybell.com/28744/Ron-Paul-When-they-came-for-the-Raw-Milk-drinkers Clive ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2013 16:57:00 -0800 From: Todd Birch Subject: WA Gun Bill: Follow-up Subject: WA Gun Bill: Follow-up Got this from a friend...amazing admission for a columnist from the Seattle Times, too! A follow-up article on that crazy gun bill (that died in committee Friday) --and perhaps even more frightening: http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2020421786_westneat24xml.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2013 16:57:26 -0800 From: Todd Birch Subject: Fw: Gotta love this Wyoming state rep! Subject: Gotta love this Wyoming state rep! http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/02/24/by-all-means-leave-the-amazingly-blunt-response-one-state-rep-gave-a-citizen-who-wrote-him-opposing-concealed-carry-in-schools/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, February 25, 2013 11:51 pm From: "Dennis R. Young" Subject: Virtual State of the Union 2013 - Guns GUNS (Virtual State of the Union 2013) Bill Whittle - Channel.66 videos - Published on 21 Feb 2013 http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=_T-F_zfoDqI In this segment of his Virtual State of the Union, the Virtual President talks about why politicians want to talk about gun control rather than crime control, and delivers the factual evidence and historical truths that make the case for the Second Amendment self-evident. For the latest from The Virtual President go to http://www.mrvirtualpresident.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, February 26, 2013 9:12 am From: "Dennis R. Young" Subject: Calgary Women's Emergency Shelter forced to turn away 3,000 ... ...women and children COMMENT: Another domestic violence priority missed because of the billions wasted on Bill C-68. Shelters forced to turn away women and children amid population boom BY TAMARA GIGNAC, CALGARY HERALD FEBRUARY 25, 2013 http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/Shelters+forced+turn+away+women+children+amid+population+boom/8010297/story.html CALGARY - A booming population and a tight rental market is putting a strain on already burdened social services for the city's most vulnerable. Almost 3,000 women and children were denied a bed at the Calgary Women's Emergency Shelter last year. Victims of domestic abuse are increasingly staying longer at the facility because they can't find affordable housing. Executive director Lisa Falkowsky said counsellors try to help women who are fleeing violence find a safe haven. But many can't be accommodated at the shelter, and those turned away are often forced to return to the same threatening places they were trying to escape, Falkowsky said. "Our clients are staying almost twice as long as they used to," she noted. "We know that 33 per cent of the women who go back to abusive partners do so because they have nowhere else to go. The lack of affordable housing is the single most significant issue in our community right now." It comes as thousands of newcomers are flocking to the province, creating an extra burden for the shelters and social networks that help the city's working poor. Statistics Canada figures from the third quarter of 2012 show Alberta experienced the biggest net influx of interprovincial migration and immigration since 2006. Nearly 14,000 more new arrivals came to the province than left in a three-month span ending Oct. 1, 2012. The population boom means low-income people often can't compete in a tight rental market because they are rejected in favour of professional couples. Many properties in Calgary are priced beyond what they can pay, acknowledged Darren Paddock, president of RentFaster.ca. "There's very few places where you can get a one bedroom for $800 a month. It's tough, with the influx of people," he said. Landlords are able to be choosy because a clean, reasonably-priced apartment will typically net dozens of calls and emails. "It definitely hurts the people on the fringes," Paddock said. One option is to apply for subsidized housing through Calgary Housing Co. Each month, there are about 3,200 low-income Calgarians waiting for vacancies. "The people from the emergency shelter do apply with us. Each of them are assessed individually, based on their circumstances, income, number of children and so on," said Judy Wilkins, manager of community and tenant services. But many linger on the waiting list with nowhere else to go. We have to go by who's the highest in need. We can't accommodate everyone - and that's the problem." The majority of Calgary Housing's funding comes from the province. But with Alberta facing a $6-billion shortfall in next month's budget, there isn't much hope for money to build enough apartments, duplexes and townhouses for those who need them. "If I had more units, I could help more people. We lobby for more funding but it comes down to whether they have the money or not," Wilkins said. The Calgary Women's Emergency Shelter saw an 11 per cent increase in the number of people who accessed its services last year, whether it be a help line, counselling services or the shelter itself. Higher demand for such social services is a trend across the province - but some argue the infrastructure to support those most has been lacking for more than a decade, particularly in the cities. "The spaces in the major urban areas have not kept pace with the population growth, let alone the increased awareness that you see in terms of domestic violence," said Jan Reimer, executive director of the Alberta Council of Women's Shelters. "There are different populations that need specialized interventions, and there's a lack of housing that leads to longer lengths of stay at shelters because where are these women supposed to go?" tgignac@calgaryherald.com Twitter:/TamaraGignac ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 08:57:57 -0800 From: Todd Birch Subject: Fw: Watch your mail : NFR - From a US friend ... Subject: Watch your mail : *Just wanted to let you know - today I received my Sequester Survival Pack from the White House**.* *It contained a parachute, an 'Obama Hope & Change' bumper sticker, a 'Bush's Fault' poster, a 'Blame Boehner' poster, a "Tax the Rich' poster, an application for unemployment, an application for food stamps, a prayer rug, a letter of assignation of debt to my grandchildren and a machine to blow smoke up my a$$. * *All directions were in Spanish. *Keep an eye out. Yours should arrive soon.* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 11:57:14 -0600 From: "Joe Gingrich" Subject: ABC broadcast edits out Michelle Obama claim http://washingtonexaminer.com/article/2522593 ABC broadcast edits out Michelle Obama claim that Chicago's teen was killed by an "automatic weapon" February 26, 2013 In an interview with Good Morning America's Robin Roberts aired this morning, First Lady Michelle Obama recalled the tragic death of 15-year-old Hadiya Pendleton who was shot and killed in Chicago after performing during the President's Inauguration celebration in Washington D.C. "She was caught in the line of fire because some kids had some automatic weapons they didn't need," the First Lady explained. "I just don't want to keep disappointing our kids in this country. I want them to know that we put them first." Chicago police reported, however, that Pendleton was shot by a man who "opened fire with a handgun before fleeing in a waiting car." It is extremely unlikely that the murder weapon was an automatic handgun, an extremely rare occurrence, even in the streets of Chicago. An overwhelming majority of handguns bought and sold in America are semi-automatic. Police officials have not recovered the firearm, but prosecutors stated that the accused attacker shot "at least six times" into the crowd. For the broadcast, ABC's Good Morning America producers edited out the First Lady's "automatic weapon" line. She was standing out in a park with her friends in a neighborhood blocks away from where my kids grow - grew - up, where our house is. She had just taken a chemistry test. And she was caught in the line of fire because some kids had some automatic weapons they didn't need. I just don't want to keep disappointing our kids in this country. I want them to know that we put them first. In the web edition of the story, however, Michelle Obama appears to be quoted in full: "She was standing out in a park with her friends in a neighborhood blocks away from where my kids.grew up, where our house is. She had just taken a chemistry test. And she was caught in the line of fire because some kids had some automatic weapons they didn't need," she said. "I just don't want to keep disappointing our kids in this country. I want them to know that we put them first." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 12:38:44 -0600 From: "Joe Gingrich" Subject: Nuclear waste meetings held in Sask *NFR* http://www.thestarphoenix.com/news/Nuclear+waste+meetings+held+Sask/8015625/story.html "Creighton, Pinehouse and the English River First Nation - have expressed interest in hosting a nuclear waste dump." The StarPhoenix February 26, 2013 A Nuclear Waste Management Organization (NWMO) official says the group was happy to answer questions about the controversial issue at recent meetings in Prince Albert and the Whitecap Dakota Nation south of Saskatoon. "It's the early days of a very long process. We were pleased we had the opportunity," said NWMO spokesman Mike Krizanc. Information meetings took place last week at sessions hosted by the Federation of Saskatchewan Indian Nations. Three northern Saskatchewan communities - Creighton, Pinehouse and the English River First Nation - have expressed interest in hosting a nuclear waste dump known as a "deep geological repository." They are among the 21 Canadian locations in the running. Advocates tout the economic benefits while opponents say there are safety, environmental and other concerns. The process to select a host site will take years, said Krizanc. The current stage is the third of nine that will be required before a final decision is made. Krizanc said the project is estimated at more than $16 billion. It will proceed only in a willing community. That means involving the communities in the region, as well as those on the potential transportation route, he said. The provincial government would also need to agree with the proposal, Kri-zanc said. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, February 26, 2013 1:52 pm From: "Dennis R. Young" Subject: NATIONAL REVIEW: Against Gun Registration NATIONAL REVIEW: Against Gun Registration Several members of Congress would like to see it become law. By Charles C. W. Cooke - - FEBRUARY 26, 2013 4:00 A.M. http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/341526/against-gun-registration-charles-c-w-cooke If, as is frequently claimed, conservative fears of a federal gun registry are paranoid and spurious, then the stand that Oklahoma senator Tom Coburn is taking in the Senate will presumably be welcomed by all sides. On this week’s Fox News Sunday, Coburn bluntly affirmed that any background-check bill emanating from the Senate “absolutely will not” contain any provision for “record-keeping of legitimate, law-abiding gun owners.” The inclusion of such a scheme, he declared, would “kill this bill” — and any others to boot. As well it should: As things stand, the Firearm Owners Protection Act mandates the federal government to destroy within 24 hours any information that it gathers during background checks; all who are jealous of their liberty must ensure that this remains law. Contrary to the claims of some on the right, President Obama has not advocated any form of gun registration. But, despite how it sometimes appears, President Obama is not the entire U.S. government, and while he may have kept quiet on the matter, others have not been so wise. Illinois representative Bobby Rush has thrice introduced the “Blair Holt’s Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act” — first in 2007, again in 2009, and, most recently, as soon as the 113th Congress convened in January of this year. Rush’s bill would require all gun owners to possess a federal firearm license and allow the attorney general to create and oversee a national gun registry. Another bill, introduced in January of this year by Representative Rush Holt, would “provide for the mandatory licensing and registration of handguns.” And Senator Dianne Feinstein, who authored the 1994 “assault weapons” ban, included registration of grandfathered weapons in her recent “assault weapons” bill and has a history of proposing national gun registration. A host of other bills include provisions, both large and small, by which the federal government might keep tabs on Americans’ gun ownership. An American gun registry has been an aim of gun-control advocacy groups for almost 40 years — and not always as a stand-alone measure. Reinforcing the worst “slippery slope” fears held by Second Amendment advocates, the chairman of the Brady Campaign explained the role of gun registries in 1976: The first problem is to slow down the increasing number of handguns being produced and sold in this country. The second problem is to get handguns registered. And the final problem is to make the possession of all handguns and all handgun ammunition — except for the military, policemen, licensed security guards, licensed sporting clubs, and licensed gun collectors — totally illegal. The threat to liberty inherent in gun registries should be painfully self-evident, especially when combined with the horrifying history of such programs elsewhere. The sheer fruitlessness of such systems, however, is not so apparent, and the uninitiated could be forgiven for wondering, “What’s the fuss?” Luckily, a few other countries — countries regarded by the gun-control lobby as being more enlightened than the United States and happily lacking in the pernicious influence of the National Rifle Association — have tried and abandoned gun registries, providing an example that Americans would do well not to follow. Canada’s experiment with a long-gun registry, ostensibly contrived to prevent “violence against women” — it’s always for “women” or “the children,” isn’t it? — achieved little more than to demonstrate what the less naïve among us already knew: that criminals do not abide by the law. As Mauser has noted, data from Statistics Canada show not just that only 4 percent of long guns used in Canadian homicides were registered, but also that the claim that such registration will help the police to “monitor potentially dangerous gun owners” is upside down. Instead, statistics reveal that Canadians who own legally registered guns are less dangerous to their fellow citizens than those who either do not own guns at all or own unregistered guns. Unsurprisingly, while the long-gun registry was in force, in not a single case did the police employ it in order to identify a murderer. When, as the culmination of a piecemeal process that began in 1995, the registry was created in 2003, Canada’s parliament promised that its cost would not exceed $2 million. By 2012, the registry had cost taxpayers $2.7 billion — a 134,900 percent increase on projections. (In the U.S., a registry costing the same amount per person would run $67 billion over the same time.) For this considerable outlay, the government reaped a homicide rate that dropped more slowly than that of the United States, a country in which gun laws have been slowly liberalized; a collection of disillusioned police forces, whose budgets were being eaten up by the growing costs of gun registration; and an angry citizenry whose indignation, Gary Mauser observes, was serious enough to create a peculiar coalition of the Reform, Progressive, Conservative, and New Democratic parties and to wipe out the Liberal party in the West. The registry was abolished in 2012. PAGE TWO: http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/341526/against-gun-registration-charles-c-w-cooke?pg=2 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, February 26, 2013 1:57 pm From: "Dennis R. Young" Subject: Tenth U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals Rules There Is No Right ... ...To Carry A Concealed Weapon Court Rules There Is No Right To Carry A Concealed Weapon Larry Bodine, Lawyers.com - Feb. 25, 2013, 6:42 AM http://www.businessinsider.com/court-rules-there-is-no-right-to-carry-a-concealed-weapon-2013-2#ixzz2LvjpQGyD In a sweeping ruling, the Tenth U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled that there is no Second Amendment right to carry a concealed firearm in public. The broad wording of the decision in Peterson v. Martinez creates a far-reaching national precedent against carrying a loaded handgun outside the home. The case began on a narrow point - a challenge by a Washington State man against Colorado's law to issue CHL permits ("Concealed Handgun License") only to state residents. But the final ruling held, "In light of our nation's extensive practice of restricting citizens' freedom to carry firearms in a concealed manner, we hold that this activity does not fall within the scope of the Second Amendment's protections." The federal court also rejected arguments that Colorado's CHL law infringed on the the Equal Protection Clause and the Privileges and Immunities Clause. To bullet-proof the ruling against an appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court, the Tenth Circuit recounted numerous court rulings and state laws dating back to 1813, and based its ruling on prior U.S. Supreme Court cases. THE VIEW FROM THE GROUND Colorado law allows people to have a firearm in their homes, places of business and cars. But to carry a concealed weapon in public, a state resident must apply to a local sheriff to get a permit. Peterson claimed that the law left him "completely disarmed." Sheriffs use locally-maintained databases to check for misdemeanor and municipal court convictions involving drugs, alcohol or violence that will disqualify a citizen. The local databases also include mental health contacts, 911 calls that do not result in an arrest, a history of aggressive driving, juvenile arrest records, plea agreements that result in deferred sentences, restraining orders in civil cases, and reports that a person is a danger to himself or others. None of this local information is stored in national databases. Non-residents cannot get a concealed-carry permit, because local sheriffs cannot get access to this kind of information held by other states, according to the court. Gray Peterson was rejected for a concealed handgun license because he had no residence in Colorado. His lawsuit to overturn that state handgun law was thrown out and affirmed by the 10th Circuit which said, "We first ask whether the Second Amendment provides the right to carry a concealed firearm. We conclude that it does not." Quoting the U.S. Supreme Court, the Tenth Circuit added, "like most rights, the right secured by the Second Amendment is not unlimited." THE BIG PICTURE The ruling is yet another setback for the NRA, which filed a brief supporting Peterson. The NRA has pursued a strategy of using litigation to eliminate gun-safety laws one at a time, which increases the sales and profits of the arms industry that funds the NRA. The strategy backfired because the lawsuit focused on the narrow issue of permits for non-residents, and blew up into an expansive ruling limiting gun rights. The ruling is a precedent in all federal courts. The heavily-funded NRA has filed many cases against small municipalities and local sheriffs nationwide, trying to pick off safety laws individually. That strategy failed when it sued to allow gun sales to minors, to overturn a limit allowing one gun purchase per month and to overturn a law allowing doctors to discuss the dangers of gun ownership with patients. Courts in each of these cases ruled against the gun lobby. "The NRA is basically helping to make sure the gun industry can increase sales," Rep. Carolyn McCarthy, a New York Democrat and longtime gun control advocate, told The Huffington Post. ANOTHER ARGUMENT SHOT DOWN In the Colorado case, Peterson also argued that his right to travel was infringed by the ban on concealed carry permits for non-residents. He cited a case where residents in New York paid a lesser toll to cross a bridge than other drivers, claiming it restricted the right to free movement. The 10th Circuit shot down the argument, saying that the right to travel was economic in nature. "The concealed carrying of a firearm does not impact his ability to pursue common calling or other employment," the court said, adding that it didn't limit his joining the National Guard or the military either. "We conclude that carrying a concealed weapon is not a privilege or immunity protected under Article IV [of the constitution]," the court ruled. "Given that the concealed carrying of firearms has not been recognized as a right . we cannot declare this activity sufficiently basic to the livelihood of the Nation." Watch below: The History of the NRA's Support for Gun Control ------------------------------ Date: Tue, February 26, 2013 2:02 pm From: "Dennis R. Young" Subject: CBC - Alleged pistol-whipping leads to B.C. weapons cache CBC - Alleged pistol-whipping leads to B.C. weapons cache Police seized 28 guns and quantity of ammunition following domestic dispute call CBC News Posted: Feb 25, 2013 5:17 PM PT Last Updated: Feb 25, 2013 9:30 PM PT http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/story/2013/02/25/bc-west-vancouver-domestic-gun-charges.html A 42-year-old West Vancouver man has been charged with eight offences after police responded to a domestic assault call and ended up seizing a large cache of guns and ammunition. En Zhong Li appeared in North Vancouver Provincial Court Monday, where he was charged with one count of aggravated assault, one count of unlawful confinement, one count of careless use of a firearm and one count of using a firearm in the commission of an offence. Li was also charged with four counts of storing a firearm contrary to regulations. West Vancouver Police Department Const. Jeff Palmer said the charges stemmed from an investigation that began when police were called to a home in the 300 block of Moyne Drive Saturday night. Palmer said police received a report of a domestic dispute in progress at around 11 p.m. PT. When officers arrived at the home, they found a 35-year-old woman with head injuries and other injuries. Police say the woman claimed the injuries were the result of being hit with a firearm several times. Officers located and arrested the suspect in the home. Police also obtained a search warrant, and then seized 28 firearms and "a substantial quantity of ammunition" that was found in the home. The 35-year-old woman was taken to hospital and has since been released, police said. Li remains in custody and will appear in court again Tuesday. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, February 26, 2013 2:11 pm From: "Dennis R. Young" Subject: Obama urged to back tough arms trade treaty at U.N. talks Obama urged to back tough arms trade treaty at U.N. talks By Louis Charbonneau, UNITED NATIONS | Mon Feb 25, 2013 7:02pm EST http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/02/26/us-arms-treaty-un-idUSBRE91P00120130226 (Reuters) - Three dozen arms control and human rights groups have written to U.S. President Barack Obama ahead of new arms-trade negotiations at the United Nations next month, urging him to back a tough treaty that would end loopholes in international weapons sales. Arms control campaigners say one person every minute dies worldwide as a result of armed violence and a convention is needed to prevent the unregulated and illicit flow of weapons into conflict zones and fueling wars and atrocities. The U.N. General Assembly voted in December to restart negotiations in mid-March on what could become the first international treaty to regulate the $70 billion global arms trade after a drafting conference in July collapsed because the United States and other nations wanted more time. "The United States, as the world's leading arms supplier, has a special responsibility to provide the leadership needed for an ATT (arms trade treaty) with the highest possible standards for the transfer of conventional arms and ammunition," the groups wrote to Obama in a letter delivered late on Friday. ,"The Arms Trade Treaty can provide a key tool to help reduce enormous human suffering caused by irresponsible international arms transfers and arms brokering," the letter said. The 36 groups that co-authored the letter include Amnesty International USA, Arms Control Association, Friends Committee on National Legislation, Oxfam America, National Association of Evangelicals and other groups. The point of the treaty is to set standards for all cross-border transfers of any type of conventional weapon - light and heavy. It also would set binding requirements for nations to review all cross-border arms contracts to ensure the munitions will not be used in human rights abuses, do not violate embargoes and are not illegally diverted. Deputy U.S. National Security Council spokeswoman Caitlin Hayden confirmed the White House had received the letter, saying it "raises a number of important issues." She said Washington would support a treaty under certain conditions. "The March 2013 Arms Trade Treaty Conference will seek an Arms Trade Treaty that will contribute to international security, (and) protect the sovereign right of states to conduct legitimate arms trade," she said in an email that provided the most extensive public U.S. statement on the treaty in months. U.S. SAYS "NO WEAK TREATY" Hayden said Washington would not support a treaty that infringed on the constitutional right of U.S. citizens to bear arms - a sensitive political issue in America. Since adoption of a treaty next month will require consensus, the United States and all other delegations have de facto veto powers. "The U.S. objective is to bring other countries in line with existing U.S. best practices, which will have a positive humanitarian impact and reduce the chances that illicit arms flow to terrorists and those that would commit human rights violations," Hayden said. She also said Washington would not accept a "weak treaty." If a treaty is approved, it will require ratification by signatories' legislatures before it goes into effect. The leading U.S. pro-gun group, the National Rifle Association (NRA), has vowed to fight hard to prevent ratification of the treaty if it reaches Washington. The treaty's supporters accuse the NRA of deceiving the U.S. public about the pact, which they say would have no impact on domestic gun ownership and would only apply to exports. The main reason the arms trade talks are taking place at all is that the United States - the world's biggest arms trader, which accounts for more than 40 percent of global transfers in conventional arms - reversed U.S. policy on the issue after Obama was first elected and decided in 2009 to support a treaty. The authors of the letter called on Obama to ensure that any approved treaty requires exporting states to "assess the risk of a proposed export being used to commit or facilitate a serious violation of international human rights or humanitarian law, or acts of terrorism." They also urged the United States not to back exclusion of ammunition from the arms trade treaty, which will be negotiated by about 150 countries at U.N. headquarters March 18-28. "The exclusion of ammunition from the scope of the treaty would greatly reduce the treaty's ability to achieve many of its most important goals," the groups wrote, adding that the United States already licenses the import and export of ammunition. But the White House made clear it would continue to oppose the inclusion of ammunition in the draft treaty. "Ammunition is a fundamentally different commodity than conventional arms," Hayden said. "It is fungible, consumable, reloadable, and cannot be marked in any practical way that would permit it to be tracked or traced." (Reporting By Louis Charbonneau; Editing by Bill Trott) ------------------------------ End of Cdn-Firearms Digest V15 #580 *********************************** Submissions: mailto:cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Mailing List Commands: mailto:majordomo@scorpion.bogend.ca Moderator email: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@scorpion.bogend.ca List owner: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@scorpion.bogend.ca FAQ list: http://www.canfirearms/Skeeter/Faq/cfd-faq1.html Web Site: http://www.canfirearms.ca CFDigest Archives: http://www.canfirearms.ca/archives To unsubscribe from _all_ the lists, put the next four lines in a message and mailto:majordomo@scorpion.bogend.ca unsubscribe cdn-firearms-digest unsubscribe cdn-firearms-chat unsubscribe cdn-firearms end (To subscribe, use "subscribe" instead of "unsubscribe".)