From: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca (Cdn-Firearms Digest) To: cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Subject: Cdn-Firearms Digest V16 #265 Reply-To: cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Sender: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Errors-To: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Precedence: normal owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Cdn-Firearms Digest Sunday, May 11 2014 Volume 16 : Number 265 In this issue: Policing for Profit? Regarding : regarding: Re: [Fwd: After Numerous Attempts, ... RE: Woman dies after bear attack at Suncor oil sands site Re: Re: Estate Questions Re: Woman dies after bear attack at Suncor oilsands site CFJ: Black Americans: A Little-Known Tradition of Arms Re: "Oilsands worker killed by black bear" Re: "Rand Paul wants 100% of pilots to have guns"-N.P. Re: Urgent Hunt for Bear That Mauled Woman in Garage April ... Mexico to legalize vigilantes fighting drug cartel Canadians, and "Canadians" My message to anyone entering the shooting sports as a newbie: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 00:04:10 -0600 From: "Joe Gingrich" Subject: Policing for Profit? http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/05/09/policing-for-profit-lawmakers- advocates-raise-alarm-at-growing-govt-power-to/ Policing for Profit? Lawmakers, advocates raise alarm at growing gov't power to seize property By Barnini Chakraborty Published May 09, 2014 FoxNews.com WASHINGTON – Motel owner Russell Caswell wasn’t expecting to find himself at the center of a national controversy when FBI agents came knocking on his door. They said they wanted his Tewksbury, Mass., business – and the land it was on – because they suspected it was a hotbed for drug-dealing and prostitution. The agents, who were working with state and local authorities, told a disbelieving Caswell they had the right to take the property, valued at as much as $1.5 million, through a legal process known as civil forfeiture. Caswell, 70, fought back, and the case turned into one of the nation's most contentious civil forfeiture fights ever – and one that legal experts say sheds light on a little-known practice that, when abused, is tantamount to policing for profit. Civil forfeiture is when police and prosecutors seize property, cars or cash from someone they suspect of wrongdoing. It differs from criminal forfeiture cases, where prosecutors typically must prove a person is guilty or reach a settlement before freezing funds or selling property. In civil forfeiture, authorities don’t have to prove guilt, file charges or obtain a conviction before seizing private property. Critics say it is a process ripe for abuse, and one which leaves citizens little means of fighting back. “You breed a culture of 'take first, ask questions later,'” Larry Salzman, an attorney with the Institute for Justice, told FoxNews.com. “It’s thuggish behavior.” Law enforcement officials argue that civil forfeiture powers give them an effective tool against lawbreakers. Freezing funds and seizing assets allow them to hit alleged criminals, frequently suspected drug dealers, where it hurts the most – their wallets. Alarmed civil rights groups and libertarians are rallying against the practice. Salzman's group defended Caswell and won case in federal court last year. But not every target of civil forfeiture can afford the fight. In 1985, the U.S. Department of Justice created its Asset Forfeiture Fund. One year later, the fund -- which holds the proceeds from seized property and is available to be divvied out to law enforcement agencies -- brought in $93.7 million. In 2008, the amount had ballooned to $1.6 billion. In 2013, it reached $6.3 billion. Across the country, many states are stepping up efforts to curb civil forfeiture abuse. In Tennessee, local law enforcement agencies get to keep 100 percent of all property seized through civil forfeiture – an incentive some say can tempt police to go after property for the wrong reasons. Rep. Barrett Rich, a former state trooper, introduced legislation last year that would eliminate the practice in the Volunteer State. The original version of Rich's bill would have required authorities to obtain a warrant before seizing property. Forfeiture and title transfer of property would take place only under due process of law and only if the owner of the property had been prosecuted and convicted. Rich's bill underwent amendments that, in the end, amounted to more modest reforms to state law. “We shouldn’t completely get rid of civil forfeiture,” Rich told FoxNews.com. “It’s a valuable tool for law enforcement, but it is also ripe for abuse.” In other states, the fight for reform has been even harder. In March, the Georgia Sheriff’s Association successfully killed a bill that would have raised the burden of proof in civil cases and mandated the forfeiture of property worth more than $5,000 be brought before a judge rather than handled administratively. GSA president and Putnam County Sheriff Howard Sills argued the bill would “demoralize the law enforcement community to a point where we will see little public benefit in enforcing the law when it comes to drug dealers and other criminal entrepreneurs.” His letter drew harsh criticism from many watchdog groups. “It is hard to believe that a Georgia law enforcement official would argue that upholding the law is worthwhile only when it is profitable,” Heritage Foundation bloggers Jason Snead and Andrew Kloster wrote. “Such are the perverse incentives created by civil forfeiture laws.” An investigation conducted by the Atlanta Journal-Constitution looked into how funds over a five-year period were spent in Georgia. According to the newspaper, Fulton County District Attorney Paul Howard spent thousands of dollars gleaned from civil forfeitures on pricey dinners and an elaborate home security system for himself. In November 2009, he allegedly paid $800 to rent out a movie theater. Three months later, Howard told his employees they’d have to take 10 furlough days due to budget constraints. To many, like attorney Salzman, civil forfeitures represent a dangerous area of the U.S. justice system where, by law, a person is supposed to be presumed innocent until proven guilty and not the other way around. On a national level, Salzman says a loophole in the federal law called equitable sharing allows authorities to circumvent the paper-thin protections offered on a state level. In Ball Harbour, Fla., police raked in more than $5 million through its participation with the Justice Department’s asset forfeiture sharing program in 2011. The town, which is home to only 2,500 permanent residents, made most of its money through the Justice Department’s Equitable Sharing program. Under the federal program, state and local agencies work in tandem with the feds and often they are allowed to keep most of what they help seize. Property is often sold, with proceeds funneled back into local coffers. They money can go toward anything from new equipment to raises and other perks from the same officials who carried out the bust. It’s the lopsided power of the law that many Americans who are targeted can’t afford to fight, Salzman says. Salzman, who took on the Caswell case pro bono, said law enforcement officials targeted his client’s property out of greed. The basic accusation they used to seize his motel was that Caswell could have done more to police what was happening in his own motel. That was news to Caswell, who says over the years he had comp’d the cops free rooms and space so they could set up stings and bust drug deals going down. “I’ve found, which is kind of hard to believe, but I’m responsible for the action of people I don’t even know, I’ve never even met, and for the most part I have no control over them,” Caswell said in court. “And I have to rent them a room unless I have a real good reason not to or I get accused of discrimination and that kind of thing.” “And when they do something wrong, the government wants to steal my property for the actions of those people, which to me makes absolutely no sense,” he added. “It’s more like we’re in Russia or Venezuela or something.” After a four-day trial, on Jan. 24, 2013, a federal judge in Boston dismissed the forfeiture action against the motel, ruling that the government engaged in “gross exaggeration” of the evidence and did not have authority to seize the property. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 00:05:54 -0600 From: "Joe Gingrich" Subject: Regarding : regarding: Re: [Fwd: After Numerous Attempts, ... ...Dr. Ben ... Date: Wed, 7 May 2014 10:41:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Bruce Mills Subject: Re: regarding: Re: [Fwd: After Numerous Attempts, Dr. Ben ... I want to add to Jeff's query: if 525,000 SBH have actually been confiscated by the FedGov, please provide proof - if you can't then stop using this bogus number. 525,000 SBH *have* been slated for eventual confiscation upon the death of those who own one, who doesn't have anyone on the "proscribed list" in 12(7) who wants them. "We" must be scrupulously honest in what we say, because the antis will get ahold of it and run with it, just like they did with the bogus Hitler quote, which I've been telling people for decades not to use, as it could not be proven to be true. Yours in TYRANNY! Bruce ------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Hi Bruce, Your figure is not correct, It is 555,200 "previously restricted firearms to be prohibited." From Justice Minister Allan Rock's -- "The Government Action Plan on Firearms Control" tabled in Parliament on November 30, i994. I also used the verb stole suggesting that Harper is stealing our firearms. Yours in Tyranny, Joe Gingrich White Fox, Sask. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 May 2014 23:21:54 -0700 From: "Clive Edwards" <45clive@telus.net> Subject: RE: Woman dies after bear attack at Suncor oil sands site "Yeah eaten alive, nobody cares, she was unarmed, why was she unarmed? but hey, it didn't kill me??? "The RCMPs?? oh, they were holding a gun for her,..... they don't care, she wasn't an RCMP member anyway. "Yes let's investigate this for the news-media for all they think it's worth, I for one would really hate to go that way, Christ a filthy smokey the bear eating me up.....get real." >Bob Sometime you gotta take dangerous, stupid laws with a grain of salt and do what you gotta do to stay alive. Some people just do as they're told without thinking about the consequences. There's no "highway of heroes" for oil workers. No medal her family can pawn when they need the money. Her death certainly feeds the RCMP, the Wildlife police, the undertaking establishment. I'll bet there are grief councellors in there somewhere. 45clive An armed society is not only a polite society, it is a safe society. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 08:22:16 -0400 From: Kindanyume Subject: Re: Re: Estate Questions Also of note.. she needs to be informed of this and that there is zero, nada, zilch legal reason for any police to try to seize the firearms period. There has been cases of this happening before and since the victims did not know the legalities they obeyed the police despite the fact they were actively and willingly breaking the law themselves. This is VERY important since we all know the police by and large do not want us to have firearms at all and those that are more active gun grabbers love cases like this where they can intimidate those that are unaware of the legal realities. On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 5:04 PM, Barry Snow wrote: > Howard, > As executor, she comes into possession through "operation of law?" and can > own them until such time as she can find another 12(6) owner or acquire her > own PAL. If the 12(6) item is newer than 1946 it cannot pass to a 12(7) > owner. If it (they) are older she can apply to become a 12(7) to retain > ownership. > > Barry > > Date: Fri, 9 May 2014 16:01:19 -0400 > From: Kindanyume > Subject: Re: Estate Questions > > Sorry Julie but you are very much incorrect on this one: > > As executor she "inherits" the same license in essence as the now deceased > person held even if she had no license in the first place. Including some > aspects that are above and beyond what was legal for the deceased owner to > do. > > Please read this link. It is a very good writeup about this and will help > dispel some of the myths such as what you posted on this subject. > > https://nfa.ca/resource-items/inheritance-and-todays-laws > > On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 3:00 PM, Julie A. McNeice > wrote: > > > They are still her property, but she has to store them at someone's > > house who has a (12-6). That person has to have to get an ATT to pick > > them up. > > > > Julie McNeice Sent from iPhone > > > > > On May 9, 2014, at 1:27 PM, "Howard R. Hamilton" wrote: > > > > > > I have a friend who's husband passed away a little over a year ago. > > > Both she and her husband have had RPAL's, but he also had 12(6). The > > > CFC has sent a renewal form for his RPAL, (due in mid August) and > > > not for hers yet (due in early September). She is also the executor > > > of his will. > > > > > > What needs to be done, other than her renewal of her RPAL to not have > > > the police banging her door down and demanding all of his guns. (She > > > also owns some long guns). > > > > > > BUZ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 08:32:22 -0400 From: Kindanyume Subject: Re: Woman dies after bear attack at Suncor oilsands site Indeed.. and I bet more employees will think of carrying regardless of an ATC or Suncor's approval now. On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 9:43 PM, Bob wrote: > On Fri, 9 May 2014 08:10:11 -0600 (CST), you wrote: > > >------------------------------ > > > >Date: Wed, May 7, 2014 10:51 pm > >From: "Dennis Young" > >Subject: Woman dies after bear attack at Suncor oilsands site > > > >Woman dies after bear attack at Suncor oilsands site > >Mark Strashok May 7, 2014 09:10:55 PM > > > http://www.660news.com/2014/05/07/woman-dies-after-bear-attack-at-suncor-oilsands-site/ > > > >A female employee at the Suncor plant north of Fort McMurray has died in a > >black bear attack. The mauling occurred around 3:30 p.m. Wednesday > afternoon > >and Occupational Health and Safety spokesman Barrie Harrison says the > animal > >was a male black bear. The woman died of her injuries on scene and > Harrison > > Yeah eaten alive, nobody cares, she was unarmed, why was she > unarmed? but hey, it didn't kill me??? > > The RCMPs?? oh, they were holding a gun for her,..... they don't > care, she wasn't an RCMP member anyway. > > >says the investigation is only beginning. He says, "RCMP, as is generally > >the case, was first on the site; the bear has since been put down. Fish > and > >Wildlife is on the scene conducting their investigation and Occupational > >Health and Safety is now on scene as well." > > Yes let's investigate this for the news-media for all they think > it's worth, I for one would really hate to go that way, Christ a filthy > smokey the bear eating me up.....get real. > > Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, May 10, 2014 9:31 am From: "Dennis Young" Subject: CFJ: Black Americans: A Little-Known Tradition of Arms by Gary Mauser CANADIAN FIREARMS JOURNAL - MAY/JUNE 2014 Black Americans: A Little-Known Tradition of Arms by Gary Mauser https://nfa.ca/canadian-firearms-journal CONTACT: mauser@sfu.ca Gary Mauser, Professor Emeritus, Institute for Canadian Urban Research Studies, Beedie School of Business, Simon Fraser University. http://www.garymauser.net/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 11:42:16 -0400 From: Kindanyume Subject: Re: "Oilsands worker killed by black bear" yep and the putz eerrr.. rcmp are always full of BS excuses blah blah and then they wonder why they have zero respect anymore.. On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 11:13 PM, Bob wrote: > > The pony boyz have real strict ATT, TAN, ATC, ATC-1, ATC-2, type > of > permits for deep woods, but even those are hard to get and "upkeep" within > the legislated parameters. > > For this event, the RCMPs may disclaim their gun limit influence > responsibility tactics, because the other workers could have used bear > spray > and she might have been menstruating, or something to that effect. > > Never the less, it's very sad that, since I could have been there > instead of her. > > Bob > > > On Fri, 9 May 2014 14:32:07 -0600 (CST), you wrote: > > > >------------------------------ > > > >Date: Fri, 9 May 2014 14:06:20 -0500 > >From: "Julie A. McNeice" > >Subject: Re: "Oilsands worker killed by black bear" > > > >Surveyors and (some) other employees in the NWT have permits and safety/ > >survival training to carry firearms for protection from bears; 'course > >that's I'm the wilds, right? And hubby, being a Surveyor says some > >surveyors in Alberta do too, but usually companies like Suncor don't > >permit them on their sites. > > > >Julie McNeice Sent from iPhone ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 11:46:08 -0400 From: Kindanyume Subject: Re: "Rand Paul wants 100% of pilots to have guns"-N.P. Simple.. why do you think no one hijacks any israeli flights? Or attacks their schools? What they did WORKS.. It's that simple.. it is a tried and proven method (not counting bombs etc of course) sadly most still cannot wrap their head around the reality of this or do not want to... On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 11:14 PM, Larry James Fillo wrote: > > http://news.nationalpost.com/2014/04/11/rand-paul-wants-100-of-pilots-to- have-guns/ > > > Rand Paul wants 100% of pilots to have guns > > > Republish Reprint > National Post Staff | April 11, 2014 2:23 PM ET > > Rand Paul wants all pilots "100% of them" to be armed. > > The Kentucky Republican Senator says that it's the best, and > cheapest, way to prevent another 9/11-style attack on America. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 12:00:34 -0400 From: Kindanyume Subject: Re: Urgent Hunt for Bear That Mauled Woman in Garage April ... ...13, 2014 once again lack of CCW.. :( On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 11:15 PM, Larry James Fillo wrote: > > > http://abcnews.go.com/US/urgent-hunt-black-bear-mauled-woman-garage/story?id#309124 > > The hunt is on today for a black bear who mauled a woman at her home in > an upscale central Florida neighborhood, leaving her with injuries to > her face, legs and torso and requiring her to get 40 stitches to the > head. > > Terri Frana of Lake Mary, Fla., went to her garage Saturday evening to > grab bicycles for her children to ride down to their neighbor's house > when the attack happened, according to her husband, Frank Frana. > > As soon as the children left, Frana, 45, saw two bears in the driveway. > She walked to the patio area where there were five bears eating trash > that they had pulled out of the garage, her husband said. > > "The bear got up on [its] hind legs and started to maul her, opened its > jaws and put her head in the mouth and dragged her towards the woods," > Frank Frana said. "Somehow she was able to pull herself out." > > "The bears were various sizes so we think it's probably cubs of > different maturity and perhaps a mama bear," the Seminole County > Sheriff's Office told ABC News. > > The Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission said there was at > least one bear involved in the attack but couldn't corroborate the > report that there had been five bears. > > Frana managed to get inside the house, said her husband. Her son found > her collapsed in the living room and called 911. She was then taken to a > local hospital where she was treated for at least three bear bites and > several cuts all over her body. > > Frana was released from the hospital Sunday morning and is recovering at > home, her husband said. > > Wildlife officials are concentrating on finding the bears, and put out > traps and searched for them throughout the night. > > The attack happened in an area 10 miles from where another woman, > 54-year-old Susan Chalfant, was mauled by a black bear while walking her > dogs last December. > > Although there has been an increase in bear sightings in the area, in > general, black bear attacks on humans are highly unusual and occur > mainly when a bear feels her cubs are threatened, according to the > Department of Natural Resources. > > People who are attacked by black bears are encouraged to stand their > ground and not back away or play dead. > > ABC News' Gillian Mohney contributed to this report. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 11:40:32 -0600 From: "Joe Gingrich" Subject: Mexico to legalize vigilantes fighting drug cartel http://news.yahoo.com/mexico-legalize-vigilantes-fighting-drug-cartel-040406200.html Mexico to legalize vigilantes fighting drug cartel ‘No one is giving up their guns, even assault weapons prohibited under Mexican law.’ By ALBERTO ARCE 13 hours ago APATZINGAN, Mexico (AP) — Mexico's government plans on Saturday to begin demobilizing a vigilante movement of assault rifle-wielding ranchers and farmers that formed in the western state of Michoacan and succeeded in largely expelling the Knights Templar cartel when state and local authorities couldn't. The ceremony in the town of Tepalcatepec, where the movement began in February 2013, will involve the registration of thousands of guns by the federal government and an agreement that the so-called "self-defense" groups will either join a new official rural police force or return to their normal lives and acts as voluntary reserves when called on. The government will go town by town to organize and recruit the new rural forces. "This is a process of giving legal standing to the self-defense forces," said vigilante leader Estanislao Beltran. But tension remained on Friday in the coastal part of the state outside the port of Lazaro Cardenas, where other "self-defense" groups plan to continue as they are, defending their territory without registering their arms. Vigilantes against the demobilization have set up roadblocks in the coastal town of Caleta. "We don't want them to come, we don't recognize them," vigilante Melquir Sauceda said of the government and the new rural police forces. "Here we can maintain our own security. We don't need anyone bringing it from outside." With Saturday's ceremony, a federal commissioner now in charge of the violence-plagued state hopes to end the "wild west" chapter of the movement, in which civilians built roadblocks and battled cartel members for towns in the rich farming area called the "Tierra Caliente," or "Hot Land." The new rural forces are designed to be a way out of an embarrassing situation, in which elected leaders and law enforcement agencies lost control of the entire state to the pseudo-religious Knights Templar drug cartel. Efforts to retake control with federal police and military failed. Eventually government forces had to rely on the vigilantes because of their knowledge of where to find the cartel gunmen. Since the commissioner, Alfredo Castillo, was named in January, federal forces have arrested or killed three of the main leaders of the Knights Templar. The fourth, Servando "La Tuta" Gomez, is in hiding and rumored to be in the rugged hills outside his hometown of Arteaga. But the vigilante movement has been plagued by divisions, and its general council dismissed one of the founders, Dr. Jose Manuel Mireles, as its spokesman earlier this week because of an unauthorized video he released directed at President Enrique Pena Nieto. Another founder, Hipolito Mora, is in jail accused of the murder of two alleged rivals. Castillo told Mexico's Radio Formula on Friday that he is also investigating claims that Mireles was involved in the killing of five vigilantes near Lazaro Cardenas on April 27. Meanwhile, no one is giving up their guns, even assault weapons prohibited under Mexican law. Vigilante Irineo Mendoza, 44, drove down from his mountain hometown of Aguililla to register his gun with authorities this week. He plans to take the weapon back home with him because, he says, the Knights Templar remain hidden in the mountains. "These are the guns we are going to fight them with," Mendoza said. Many predict little will change after Saturday. "This (demobilization) agreement is just something to please the government," said Rene Sanchez, 22, a vigilante from the self-defense stronghold of Buenavista. "With them or without them, we are going to keep at it." ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 May 2014 13:18:33 -0700 From: j davies Subject: Canadians, and "Canadians" Surely the Canadians referred to below are actually "Canadians" in that they are here [or their parents were here] thanks only to the Lieberal Party policy of the day, which, as ever, was based on airy-fairy soft boiled progressive numbskull theories dreamed up in some drugged up academic setting by spoiled little rich kids with no clue. You know, like Justin Turdeau. They are as Canadian as roadside bombs, vaginal mutilation and honor killings. > Following the deaths of several Canadian extremists in Syria, Somalia > and North Africa, and amid concerns those who survive their > misadventures could return home to wage violence, police have been > encouraging Canadians to let them know if a friend or family member is > becoming radicalized. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, May 10, 2014 5:11 pm From: "Dennis Young" Subject: My message to anyone entering the shooting sports as a newbie: FIREARMS DIGEST POSTING owner-cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Cdn-Firearms Digest Friday, May 9 2014 Volume 16 : Number 260 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, May 8, 2014 8:42 pm From: "mikeack" Subject: My message to anyone entering the shooting sports as a newbie: My message to anyone entering the shooting sports as a newbie: Welcome to the life! Just to start your firearms education: 1) All lawful shooters are our friends. I support them all, even if someone else's sport is something I do not personally like. For example, I don't particularly like trophy hunting, but as long as it is done ethically and legally I realize that it adds financial value to maintaining healthy animal populations and ecosystems, creates jobs in otherwise impoverished areas, and huge injections of funds into local economies and conservation programs. 2) There is no such thing as a bad gun. Guns have no volition of their own. They are just tools that will do what we ask of them. There is a huge range of interest in everything from single shot black powder antique muzzle loaders to fully auto, belt fed, crew served machine guns, and everything in between. All lawful gun use is good, even those activities I personally have no time for, interest in, or money for, and I support them all. 3) Guns are designed to launch projectiles in order to protect human and livestock life from predation, to provide food for the table, to help their owners win competitions, and to advance the engineering evolution of the industry. They are no more purposefully designed kill than are knives or baseball bats. 4) Assault is a verb not an adjective. There is no such thing as an "assault weapon". That is a term invented by the antis to besmirch us in the minds of the non-shooters, and make them fear us. The proper terms are "modern battle rifle", "personal defense firearm", and "modern sporting rifle". 5) Anything is a weapon when used to assault someone or some animal. The antis have been calling our tools "weapons" for a couple decades now. We should not help them denigrate us. I call my guns, "guns". 6) Anything can be used for good, unintentionally misused to cause harm, or intentionally abused for evil. The gun has no morality and is vastly more often safely used than misused or abused. 7) Guns are the only tools that can allow the old, the ill, the weak, the small, the female, and the few to effectively defend themselves against the young, healthy, strong, large, male mob intent on harming them. 8) Regarding firearms, a cop is a high school graduate who passed a security check, with about 20 hours of firearm training divided into 15 hours classroom and 5 hours on the range. They have no special secret powers. Most never handle their firearms outside of mandatory annual qualifications that require them to hit a human sized target from contact range to 7 meters. Compared to this, most lawful shooters will have much broader and deeper knowledge and experience with firearms than the police. The lawful gun owner is 1/3 as likely as the general population and 1/2 as likely as the police to ever be involved in criminal violence. The public has no problem allowing the police to carry guns in public and yet for some strange reason the thought of one of us doing so has them quaking in fear. And yet when someone calls 911, what they want is for someone else to bring a gun to their aid, a gun that would be much more useful in their hand at the moment when they are in the act of being attacked, than in the holster of a cop who is at best several minutes away. The bad guy is always the one to choose the time, manner, and place of their attack, and they will always do so to maximize their chances of success, not yours or the police's. If all you do is call 911, you will wait the rest of your tragically prematurely truncated life for help that will inevitably arrive in time to gather evidence from your body for presentation in court later. 9) Every jurisdiction that has gotten out of the way of lawful, trained, effective personal defense (AKA concealed carry) has seen huge declines in criminal violence. All the mass killings are in "Gun Free Zones". 95% of violence in America occurs in 5% of the land area, and those areas are typically "gun free" inner city. 10) The antis claim the moral high ground, stating that "if it just saves one life then it's worth it" to destroy the rights of millions to effectively defend themselves in order to futilely abuse the legal process to try to stop a few murders, and at a huge cost in life and freedom. The antis project their own self image onto us. They are the ones who would be dangerous with a gun, who are filled with impotent rage, not us. Thus endeth today's lesson. I hope you find it informative. Your homework, should you so desire is to read this: http://jpfo.org/filegen-n-z/ragingagainstselfdefense.htm -- M.J. Ackermann, MD (Mike) Rural Family Physician, Sherbrooke, NS mikeack@ns.sympatico.ca "Hope for the best, but be prepared for the worst". ------------------------------ End of Cdn-Firearms Digest V16 #265 *********************************** Submissions: mailto:cdn-firearms-digest@scorpion.bogend.ca Mailing List Commands: mailto:majordomo@scorpion.bogend.ca Moderator email: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@scorpion.bogend.ca List owner: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@scorpion.bogend.ca FAQ list: http://www.canfirearms/Skeeter/Faq/cfd-faq1.html Web Site: http://www.canfirearms.ca CFDigest Archives: http://www.canfirearms.ca/archives To unsubscribe from _all_ the lists, put the next four lines in a message and mailto:majordomo@scorpion.bogend.ca unsubscribe cdn-firearms-digest unsubscribe cdn-firearms-chat unsubscribe cdn-firearms end (To subscribe, use "subscribe" instead of "unsubscribe".)